One of the ways that upline diamonds would put down jobs was to toss in the phrase that a job was simply trading hours for dollars. As if it were demeaning to have a job where you got paid for your time. I believe it's all relative. Being that many IBos are young and maybe working in more entry level types of jobs, then yeah, your hours wage might not be that great. If you earn say $10 an hour, then you might be struggling financially and it may take time before your skills and knowledge increase to a point where your experience is worth more money. What if you had a job paying $1000 an hour and earned $160,000 a month? Is that a lousy deal trading hours for dollars? I think not!
Conversely, having a business can be good or bad also. If you have an Amway business earning less than $100 a month and you spend $200 on functions, standing orders and other training and motivational materials, then you are losing money. You would be better off working for free. That is still a better alternative than working a business where you are losing money. I think most people agree that a platinum group typically has a 100 or more IBOs. Thus a platinum is in the top one half of 1% of all IBOs. I have heard that the platinum level is where you start to break even or make a little profit, depending on your level of tool consumption. If platinums are barely making a profit, then the other 99+% of IBOs are likely losing money. How much is that worth per hour?
I think uplines cleverly trick IBOs into thinking that a job is bad. Trading hours for dollars, afterall, sounds like some kind of indentured servant of sorts. But in the end, what matters is your bottom line. If you are an IBO with little or no downline, and/or not much in terms of sales to non IBOs/customers, then you are losing money each and every month if you are attending functions and buying standing orders. Your 10-12 hours a week of Amway work is costing you money! But if you spend 10-12 hours a week, even at minimum wage, then you might be making about 300 to 350 a month groww income. After taxes, you make about 250 to 300. At least trading hours for dollars gets you a guaranteed net gain at the end of the month.
Uplines trick you into a "business mentality" where you think that working for a net loss is just a part of business. IBOs should realize that a business promoted as low risk and no overhead should be one where you can profir right away. Instead, IBos are taught to delay gratification, or to reinvest any profit back into their business in the form of tools and functions, which results in a net loss. If that's the case I would choose trading hours for dollars.
Remember, trading hours for dollars is not a bad deal if you are making enough dollars per hour. And even those who make less, are better off that those who "run a business" but end up with a net loss. It's all relative and hopefully, this message will help new or prospective IBOs who are being enticed to join the Amway business opportunity. Good luck to those with jobs and those with businesses. You can be successful either way. Remember that!
If people get satisfactions from their jobs, such as being teachers, fire fighters, research scientists, the feeling of accomplishment from such jobs is priceless. Moreover, it is no doubt more satisfying than trying to recruit people into the business through any means necessary.
ReplyDeleteS. Amarillo
Spot on comments!
DeleteYes! There's a saying that goes "Money without purpose is greed". Purpose of Amway? Money, money, and more money. Just pure greed. Absolutely disgusting.
DeleteTwiggy
Hey Joe!
ReplyDeleteI've been reading Anna's blog (Married to an Ambot) for a bit now and just discovered your blog as well. While I'll stay anonymous, I'd like to introduce myself as Twiggy (nickname, don't ask). I recently broke up with a girl due to Amway interfering with our relationship. She invited me to a "business seminar", and studying the business field, I was interested and went. Of course, it wasn't what she claimed it to be, and was just an Amway recruitment night. The whole time I was there, I could feel something very wrong, although I didn't know what it was. I just had a terrible, scared feeling. After doing some research, I discovered the horrors of Amway. Being a scam is one thing, but having it compared to a cult really shocked me. I attempted to talk to her about it and she flipped out! Mind you, this girl is the kindest, most warm-hearted person I've ever met, and she suddenly went dark-side on me! We didn't talk for a while but I made up with her (sucked up to her) knowing the relationship was over, but wanted to see how I (if possible) could get her out of Amway, but that lasted about 2 weeks and she broke it off with me about a week ago (probably was advised by her upline "mentors" to break up with me). I'm not sad, as I know that although it was her decision at the end, she's not the girl that I fell in love with, but a brainwashed Amway "IBO". I now have a personal agenda with Amway in educating others about how it's not only a scam, but a cult that is detrimental financially, mentally, emotionally, and even physiologically.
Now, over time, I've taught myself a lot of random skills, and would like to use those skills to try and prevent future victims of Amway. I'm pretty much a media expert in that I can do the following: web development, motion graphics, typography, animation, film, special effects, music production, graphic design, brand development, and media management. I'm currently developing a website in which I will post infographics and videos as well as articles such as yours for the internet to look at, as well as a forum. If you're interested, I'd like your help in gathering awareness to my website once it's up.
Thanks,
Twiggy.
Hi Twiggy, and I hope you come back to read this reply. I was an up and coming Amway IBO at one time, but I had started to suspect the tool scam. Long story short, my upline told me to dump my fiancee' because I could build the business faster and a single platinum or ruby could get any girl he wanted. Well, that and my conclusion about the tool scam led me to quit.
DeleteThe person he wanted me to "dump" will be celebrating our 20th anniverssary in a few months.
To get the word out, I would recommend you start your own blog and then link mine to it to attract more visitors. It will help get your story out.
Many Amway supporters often claim that AMway is changed and different but then I still see stories like yours often enough to know that not much has changed at all over the years.
Thanks for your reply Joe! That's really great to hear, and congratulations on your 20th anniversary, and I hope more great things happen for the both of you. It's really messed up how Amway destroys people in so many ways, and I'm glad you got out of it.
DeleteI don't intend on creating a blog, but a full fledged website completely dedicated in educating people about Amway and MLMs in general.
Thanks,
Twiggy
Thanks Twiggy,
DeleteI appreciate your comments and good luck to you! I'd appreciate it if you let me know when your information page is up and running.
Good luck in your endeavors!
Sure, at any salaried job you are "trading trading hours for dollars."
ReplyDeleteAt Amway, on the other hand, you're LOSING dollars for hours.
Anyone who joins Amway must have failed math in high school.
Amway's IBOs say if the dream is big enough, the facts don't matter!
DeleteI just don't understand how people can be stupid enough to join it. First of all, in Amways OWN reference guide, it says on every page down at the bottom, "The average income of ACTIVE IBO's were $153 a month". Active meaning they attended all meetings, events, bought all books, cd's, streams and did everything upline told them to do. It says later in the guide that the number is GROSS not NET. Take into account all expenses such as books, streams, voicemails, vehicle wear and tear, travel expenses, time, effort, buying from yourself, other expenses (if applicable) such as utility, rent, phone, internet, payments of any kind, and there's no way that a gross of $153 can support you in anyway. And that $153 is AVERAGE. Let's say you were a one-of-a-kind Amway "IBO", and you were so good, that you were 2 times MORE effective than "the average". That's still only $306 MONTHLY. Let's take it a step further, you're one-in-a-million and you were doing 3 times better than all IBO's! That's $459 and that number is still GROSS. You can make that in one paycheck (that's 2 weeks for you Ambots) with any $10/hour job.
DeleteI also remember when I went to the recruitment night, on THEIR own powerpoint, in fine print, it said "Of all IBO's (in the world), only 0.0315% of IBO's made diamond". Now Diamond is THE DREAM level of any IBO. But take a look at that number. 0.0315%. That's not even 1%. In fact, that's nowhere NEAR 1 %. In the team I was with during that recruitment night, there was roughly 70 people there that seemed like they were already an IBO (based on how they dressed, newbies just wore plain jeans and t-shirts). Let's do SIMPLE math. 0.000315 * 70 = 0.02205. 0.02205 people were diamonds there. And that number is basically 0, and that number was true, cause no one (except for the celebrity Diamond that came to speak to us) was diamond. All of you IBO's have a 0.0315% chance of becoming a Diamond. If you're so "business" minded, hell even took into account luck and chances, 0.0315% is not a very good chance at all. 4/5 businesses fail within their first year (funny enough 4/5 businesses write business plans before starting a business). That's still a 20% chance which is roughly 635 times more of a chance than 0.0315%. I might lie, but numbers don't. Do the math you idiot Ambots.
Twiggy
Correction on my earlier post: 4/5 businesses DON'T write business plans before starting.
DeleteTwiggy
Right, if you actually evaluate Amway and not get sucked in by hype, you'll see that the numbers are really condemning against Amway.
DeleteIf your girlfriend became enraged when you tried to discuss the cult-like nature of Amway with her, that only shows that, deep down, she is aware of the truth if what you were saying.
ReplyDeletePeople get violently angry when you touch a sore spot that they are trying to forget or repress. The anger is an extreme form of defensiveness against an unwanted idea.
This is actually a good sign. Even though she has broken up with you, your girlfriend will remember what you said to her. And as the Amway net draws tighter and tighter around her, she'll have that memory as a means of breaking free.
It's sad but for Amway, people have to snap out of it on their own. Being told and shown facts usually doesn't work. It's really sad how the Amway leaders play on this loyalty to suck them out of more money.
DeleteThey will snap out once they realize that they kept losing money over and over and that their efforts are futile.
DeleteMy ex girlfriend also gellnintotnhr am away trap and when I decided to quit doing it with her we ended up splitting up....her up line tris calling me to see how I was doing and when I questioned her about the business she became very angry and defensive to the point of yelling at me on the phone....when I hung up she phones back and left a long winded message saying"I thought your where better then that" my first thoughts where anyone that gets that defensive and angry about another's opinion must be fighting that there is truth to it....poor brainwashed Ambots
ReplyDeleteThe sad thing is that the Ambots trult believe they are doing you a favor by signing you up. I was once there. It's sda but scary.
DeleteTo Anonymous of December 11 -- Yes, you are right. Amway IBOs are extremely defensive about Amway, because deep down they know that it is a fraud and a con-game. In addition, they are painfully aware that the vast majority of people think of Amway as a rotten scam.
DeleteThey won't admit these truths to themselves. When you bring the truth up to them, they freak out in anger.
I feel all of these kind of conversations are all the same. From reading all the accounts I read online, they always try to connect you with your mentors, so I decided to ask her over text and she said something similar as well. She said, "It's interesting, you're way too smart to be saying this kind of stuff". She tried to call me, and I knew it was her trying to do a conference call with her platinum, so I didn't answer the phone, but it was scary how she turned a research-based argument into a personal one, and started to attack me personally.
DeleteTwiggy
Amwayers are very defensive. They are sometimes compared to the mob because of their defensiveness and rallying to protect and defend their leaders.
DeleteAnyone who wants to see the criminal, Mafia-like structure of Amway should read Prof. G. Robert Blakey's "Amway Report" (available on-line), which points out the precise parallels between organized crime "families," and the various major down-lines of Amway. In both cases, legitimate enterprise is used to mask a much larger criminal enterprise.
DeleteAmway fought tooth-and-nail to prevent the publication of this report. They failed. Their thuggish lawyers are still trying to figure out a way to eradicate Prof. Blakey's report from the Internet.
This is something Upline give and ask to read every day... the funniest thing i ever came across... its called as Self Talk..:)
ReplyDeleteI am the Best. I have a big dream. I am willing to serve my family. I am ready to pay the price. God is on my side. I am Excited. I am fired up. Everybody I am talking to wants to see the the plan. Everybody I show the plan to wants to Join My Team Right away. Everybody who signs up in my team, becomes core from day one. I am sponsoring EAGLES and DOUBLE EAGLES in my team. I am filling coliseums.My Function Numbers are doubling every BBS. My SOP and BOM numbers are doubling every month. My PV is shooting through the roof. Everyone in my team does 300PV circle. I am breaking pins after pins - silvers, golds, platinums, rubies, sapphires, emeralds, diamonds, CAMs. I have the happiest, most united, excited, hardworking, Sharp, ambitious, team of SINGLES and COUPLES in the history of Amway and Britt Worldwide. I am a Free MAN.
I create my own Destiny………
I am a diamond and I am going CAM. I can do it. It's a DONE DEAL. I am a diamond and I am going CAM. I can do it. It's a DONE DEAL. I am a diamond and I am going CAM. I can do it. It's a DONE DEAL. I am a diamond and I am going CAM. I can do it. It's a DONE DEAL.
PERIOD
There was an IBO running a WWDB blog named Shaun Guthrie. Nice enough guy but he was sucked in big time. He spoke about buying homes in cash and retiring as a double eagle ruby. That was in 2009 and by 2013 or so, he was out of the business. Sad but a very predictable ending.
DeleteLike I said, Amway believes in mantras rather than thought. Repeat the mantra over and over, and it will magically change your life.
ReplyDeleteTinkerbelle thinking" is what it is.
LOL, when the dream is big enough, the facts don't matter.
DeleteIt is interesting that non of your claim or numbers fit my experience with amway in past few months, joe. I haven't been here for a while for some reason but it is still good to read your stuffs and see if I can answer the sound tough questions with the true I have seen. Well, it happen that I can answer it by the facts
ReplyDeleteFact one: No diamond in our system make money from tools, we don't sell tools at all.
Fact two: I made small money , business expenses are much lower than you said (you said it is like 800-1000 a month ? ) , I don't think it could be over $80 per month.
Fact three ： amway product is good and it sales. Of course , most product were sold to "IBO"s . Because it cost nothing to join (if they purchase more than 200 dollars a year) so I encourage all my customer to be IBOs to get the best price. As most of them are in fact consumers , they feel well with amway product and buying regularly.
Fact four: I made net money with fast track program from the second month and business stay growing. I find it is well possible to make 1000 dollars just by sell product itself.
I've never heard of a system that sells no tools. In fact, if there are no tools, then it is not a system. You might be able to make some money selling products but the REAL money is in sponsoring a big downline and selling theim tools.
Delete