Is Your Amway Upline Your "Coach"?

In the Amway business, many active IBOs are advised to trust upline. To think of upline as a coach or a mentor. These upline mentors or coaches are supposed to have your best interest at heart and they will guide you to success if only you will be open to learning. Many uplines, including my former uplines used to coin the term "copy" or duplicate. If you can do that you will be successful. Even the simplest of people can copy. The upline may crack a joke about getting thru school by copying. Thus, many IBOs follow exactly what their upline advises them to do.

But then uplines turn the responsibility away from themselves. Many Amway defenders will also claim that downline should not simply follow the advice of upline. They may make a ridiculous claim that standing orders and functions contain advice that must be discerned. That information is like a buffet. You pick and choose what you need and discard the rest. If you are a new IBO or prospect, let me tell you that is a load of guano (crap) that is being heaped on you. Your upline is touted as having experience and wisdom in the Amway business, which is why you are paying good money for voicemail, books, cds, and functions. So why would their advice be something you pick and choose? How would a new IBO know what to pick and choose?

Imagine hiring a guide for a trek in the wilderness. The guide is supposed to be an experienced outdoorsman, perhaps an expert. So if he recommends that you eat certain plants or fruits, you trust that he is going to guide you right. Imagine eating something that made you sick to your stomach, only to have the guide tell you that he just points out plants and fruits and you have to discern which is good for you and which is not. You would fire the guide and tell everyone you know not to use that guide anymore.

But here we have these "systems" such as Network 21, WWDB or BWW that have been "guiding" IBOs for up to 20 years or more in some cases, and the number of diamonds are negligible. Sure there are many new platinums, but many tool consuming platinums have been found to be losing money or making very little money for their efforts. What's more, it would appear that Amway is losing ground in North America based on sales. One can reasonably guess that any new platinums that break are simply replacing the volume for a platinum that no longer exists or a platinum that no longer qualifies. My former upline diamond appears to have all new qualifying platinums from the time I was in the business and here's the kicker. My former diamond had 6 downline rubies. As far as I know, none of these rubies are qualified as platinum anymore, although I have heard that some of these are still active.

Uplines also program their downline to take responsibility for the failure. Thus you have IBOs who did everything that was asked of them, only to fail. Yet these IBOs often blame themselves for their failure. It is my opinion that former IBOs who did everything asked of them only to fail should file a formal complaint against their LOS with the better business bureau. Amway defenders like to think that a lack of formal complaints means that the system works when clearly, there is no unbiased substantial evidence to suggest that the system works. It looks like some succeed in spite of the system, not because of.

The catch in all this is uplines skirting responsibility for the outcomes of those they "mentor" and profit from. IBOs should ask if upline really cared about their success, why do you have to pay for any help that you receive from your upline diamond?

Amway IBOs Reap What They Sow?

One of the things that many prospects and IBOs believe is that they will make an investment of time and money into Amway and that they will eventually get their time and money back in such abundance that they can walk off their jobs, and walk the beaches of the world while living on lifelong residual income, all because of the Amway opportunity. For IBOs and prospects of Amway, I wonder if any of you can actually name even five people who have actually accomplished this? Keep in mind that there have probably been tens of millions of people who also wanted this and tried Amway and the systems, only to find that reality paints a different picture.

Many people they will reap what they sow. While that many sound true, I guess the next logical question is what are you sowing? Are you deceptive when prospecting people to see the plan? Are you having to justify and hide price comparisons that are not favorable? Are you actually selling goods to customers and actually qualifying for your Amway bonus? Do you have a negative opinion (broke losers) about people who don't join Amway or are not interested in seeing the plan? Do you now think your boss and your job are evil? Do you leave your kids at home to attend endless numbers of functions and meetings? You reap what you sow correct?

I wonder what some WWDB diamonds were sowing? At least the ones who had their homes foreclosed, and one in particular was involved in chapter 7 bankruptcy proceedings? Are they reaping what they sowed? What about the WWDB diamonds who got divorced? What were they sowing? Are IBO sure about wanting to make the claim of reaping and sowing? And yes, Joecool the person also has his own flaws, but the difference is that I am not on stage proclaiming to be flawless and many diamonds would imply when they speak (and profit from) their tens of thousands of downlines. I am not earning a living by deceiving people and profiting from people I am supposed to be helping.

Are you reaping what you sow?

Is Your Upline A Mentor Or A Lousy Consultant?

The really insidious part about some of the LOS leaders, such as the ones I had in WWDB, is that they apparently are cutthroat ruthless businessmen with nice suits, and disguised as your mentors and friends. They get you to trust them, and they will tell you that they have your best interest at heart, or that they would never purposely lead you astray. On the surface, you may think this is true, but look at their actions and you can easily discern that some of these uplines are absolutely ruthless businessmen who would take every cent from you if they could. I was in WWDB and I have good reasons to believe that they are still doing this, based on a WWDB IBO blog. On this blog, I see all the same teachings today, that I heard as an IBO and some of the same claims such as buying homes in cash. It's scary.

As an IBO, the diamonds would tell you to never miss a function, ever. The only good reason for missing a function was for your own funeral. I recall some crossline IBOs rearranging pre-planned anniverssary parties, weddings, and other special family events in the name of being core and attending all functions. Some IBOs actually did quit their jobs to attend functions and they very well may have done so because some uplines taught this. IBOs were also encouraged and told to go into debt to attend a function. This was okay because it was an investment into your business.

Our group was also strongly encouraged to buy extra cds every week. To be core, you needed to listen to a cd each day and you cannot listen to the same one each day right? Couples were told to buy their own seperate standing orders. Brad Duncen even had a true north tape (cd) that said sponsors were to eat the standing orders for downlines who quit because it was too much trouble to call upline who calls upline who calls upline to cancel a standing order. Oddly enough, they didn't mind upline calling upline calling upline to add a standing order.

In the end, I was lucky enough to have been progressing up the pin ranks so my losses were not that devastating. I ended up losing in my early months of the business but mostly broke even when I was at 4000 PV. Sadly though, my crossline did not fare so well. I know of one couple who declared bankruptcy. I don't know how much their WWDB involvement contributed to bankruptcy, but I am certain it was a major factor and I know of two couples who had homes foreclosed, and I believe that their allegiance to WWDB was a factor in those foreclosures. But I guess hey, two WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed so maybe they were duplicating?

Do not be fooled. The diamonds may have a nice smile and a nice suit, but they are ruthless businessmen who will take your last dime if you allow them to.

Amway Makes You "Rich"?

Amway can make you rich. Many IBOs say they were told that Amway was not "get rich quick". But obviously, someone must have given them the impression that Amway would eventually make them rich, otherwise, why would anyone join? Why would anyone want to work that hard and embarrass themselves in front to friends and family to promote a business that will more likely get you funny looks than money. But can Amway actually make you rich?

Well, yeah, Amway can make you rich if you are a diamond selling voicemail services, books, standing orders and function tickets. Amway can make you rich if you own Amway and sell to millions of IBOs who "buy from themselves". Amway can make you rich if you write a book that millions of IBOs purchase. Amway can make you rich if you can get enough loyal downline to keep purchasing products so that you can get the bonuses. But aside from these few people who I just described, the Amway opportunity is more likely to make you broke, or at least lighter in the pockets.

Most IBOs do not even earn enough to cover their monthly voicemail expenditures, much less the other support materials that are pushed on the downline in groups such as WWDB or BWW, or N21. These materials are touted as the "key to success" in Amway when in reality, it is the key to success for the uplines who share in the profits from these materials. The real kicker is despite claims that these materials are key to success, the uplines get their followers to blame themselves if the system doesn't work for them. Kind of like tossing a coin and saying "heads I win, tails you lose". Upline wins as long as you buy support materials from them, and your results are of no consequence to them. In fact they probably don't want new diamonds as they would then have to share the tool money.

So can Amway make you rich? I would guess it is possible, but it is also possible for you to win the powerball lottery. It takes normally, over 100 downline IBOs to create a platinumship. And a platinumship occurs less than once in 200 IBOs. And at that level, you likely make little profit or break even. That tells me a whole lot. What does it tell you?

Amway Complaints?

Over the years, I have seen literally hundreds (if not more) blogs and testimonials about Amway. Most of them decry the pitfalls of being an Amway IBO. Most of the complaints cite the fact that Amway in general has higher prices than comparable retailers and the fact that the system consisting of voicemail, books, cds and seminars ate up any profits the IBO may have made and resulted in net losses for most. One particular Amway apologist bemoans the fact that the internet is full of bad testomonials about Amway. The reason why there are so many negative testimonials about Amway is because over the years, thousands, possibly millions either had a bad experience for the reasons I cited above, or personally know of someone who had a bad experience.

Amway defenders will often cite the fact that many IBOs sign up and "do nothing" as their defense to this. But I will easily point out that I haven't seen anyone say they signed up, failed to do anything or order products, quit and started blogging about a bad experience in Amway. These defenders will also compare Amway to the gym where people sign up and "do nothing". Whether true or not, I also do not see people who sign up and "do nothing" complain about not receiving health benefits by simply signing up. It is a very weak defense. Conversely, I have seen numerous accounts of folks like myself who did put in effort, some for many years, who did what upline advised and did not see the financial rewards that is promoted in "the plan".

Amway defenders will then try to justify themselves, saying that the better business bureau (BBB) receives few formal complaints about Amway. I will agree with this. Many IBOs never bother to file formal complaints to the BBB or to Amway because in many, probably most cases, the person who quits and may have had a bad experience, was sponsored into the business. The sponsor was often a friend or family member of the IBO who left the business. Many will simply leave and forget the episode and chalk it up to a learning experience in life. Some will complain, but really have to ne venue to voice their remorse about joining. Some of us have found the interent to be quite effective in sharing our experiences and our opinions on why the business did not work. This is what one Amway defender calls the "internet war". What I have pointed out is that critics most often simply point out what the IBOs themselves have done. In many cases, the IBO is his own worst enemy. Afterall, critics didn't deny Amway and Quixtar had a connection, nor did critics make up claims about perfect water, etc.

It would appear that most of the problems has a root in the AMO systems, such as WWDB, BWW, LTD, or N21. Now, not all upline leaders are unethical, but it appears that many are, and new IBOs have no way to identify the good from the bad. It also appears that some of these upline leaders will issue bad avice. Advice that is detrimental to the IBOs, but financially beneficial to themselves, such as telling IBOs to never miss a function, or to buy more cds. In many cases, these unethical uplines do not care about IBO success, their goal is just to move as many support materials as possible, so they can fund their "diamond" lifestyle. Sadly, it is also apparent that the diamond lifestyle may be a facade in some cases. An illusion of wealth portrayed as a recruiting tool.

If you recognize some of these warning signs, ask tough questions of your potential sponsor and visit this or some of the blogs linked to this one for more information.

Why Most Amway IBOs Can't Build A Business?

Building an Amway business. That's what many IBOs set out to do, except they don't know how to build a business, and based on IBO behavior and the things they say and do, it makes me wonder what their upline actually knows about building a business. A typical business owner will get started, and needs people to know that their business is there.

When you open a store or a restaurant, you may not make a lot of money intitially because not enough customers know about your store and you have not yet built a reputation. New customers who have a good experience are likely to return for more, and they are also likely to tell others about your store. Over time, you create a customer base and your weekly sales become consistent and somewhat predictable. Conversely, if customers have a bad experience, they are likely to tell others as well.

In the Amway business, many IBOs have no idea about building a business. They are shown great (apparent) wealth by upline, and then told that their business activity consists of showing the plan, listening to standing order and attending functions. Most of an IBO's activity, as prescribed by upline, costs money instead of generating sales. Some uplines do teach IBOs to sell items, but more often than not, it is not taught as a priority.

What's more, as I said, a new business will get repeat customers when a customer has a good experience. What do you suppose happens when IBOs lie or trick people into attending Amway meetings, or deceive people about their business, or make up wild stories about perfect water? What happens when you embellish the truth about success and then cannot provide an answer when a recruit asks and IBO how they are doing in the Amway business? What happens when an IBO tells a potential recruit that he or she is a loser or stupid for not joining Amway? Would you return to a store if they called you stupid as you were leaving? What if you were called a loser?

These are the reasons why IBOs in general cannot get enough customers to sustain a consistent and predictable amount of sales, and why over the years, Amway has at best a spotty reputation. Just the mention of the name Amway and you may get funny looks from people. It is why certain internet zealots promoting Amway do more harm than good.

Amway IBOs And Personal Responsibility?

One of the disturbing things I have noticed about Amway IBOs and IBO leaders is how they wlll tell downline to trust them. To trust them as they have already blazed a trail. No need to re-invent the wheel. Just ride the coattails of your upline to success. The system is proven. Many IBOs take this to heart and put forth tremendous effort. Then when they fail, upline will shun them and tell them that the failure is their own. That they are personally responsible for failure. Where's the responsibility of the upline? Why aren't they held accountable for the people who trusted them and followed their advice?

Now I am not talking about IBOs who sign up and do nothing, or never place an order. I do believe that the fact that many IBOs sign up and do nothing brings concerns about how these IBOs were recruited, but I did not recall ever seeing an IBO do nothing and then complain that Amway was a scam or anything like that. Most of these IBOs will fade away and never be heard from again.

I have found, however, that many people who are critical of Amway and the systems, put forth much effort, did everything they were told, and did not find the success that upline promoted, or in some cases, guaranteed. My former sponsor was still active, last I heard and has been in Amway for over 18 years. I do not believe he has ever gone beyond platinum, and I know that he was never a Q12 platinum. Some Amway apologists might see being a platinum as a bonus, but when you are hard core sold out to the systems, platinum is a break even or make a small profit business. Factor in that time spent by husband and wife and these folks are breaking even or making a fraction of minumum wage. Is this the dream that will allow you to buy mansions with a cash payment? There are likely many instances where platinums fully sold out to the systems still end up losing money as the support materials and functions can add up quickly.

What is also disturbing is how people will tout the system as responsible for any success, but hide the vast majority that the system doesn't help. Sure, some will succeed in Amway, but for every success, there are hundreds if not thousands who fail. And if you consider diamond as the benchmark of success, the failures could be in the millions. As I said, some succeed, but very very few in relation to the number who try. Going diamond is probably less common in the US than winning the lottery. Amway is a business opportunity, but the overall results for success are similar to a lottery. What does that tell you?

Succeed and the systems and upline take credit, but fail or quit and it is your own responsibility. Are these the kinds of leaders or mentors you want advice from?
I will pass.