Tuesday, November 29, 2011

Only Amway IBOs Are "Winners"?

One of the things that my upline taught, and I believe is still taught today in various groups is that winners join Amway and losers do not. Or that you were a winner because you were doing something to better your financial future and those who didn't were losers. or broke minded. Of course the upline who said this had no knowledge about those who were not in Amway. Some of them may already have been financially sound or may have been doing something to better their financial future. I'm not sure why these uplines, who promote "positive", had to resort to calling people losers simpy because they did not agree that Amway was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

In many games or sporting events, there will be someone or a team that wins the game and someone or a team that loses the game. Losing a game doesn't make you a loser and certainly, a team that wins the game would not say the losing team were losers. Can you imagine a pro football team's coach taking the podium after a game and saying his team won because the other team was a bunch or broke minded gutless losers? That would never happen, yet we see that frequently in the Amway/IBO world. The owner of Amway, Rich DeVos had once said in a recorded message that just because people do not agree with you (paraphrased) about Amway, does not make them losers and that IBOs should not call people losers.

In all of this, people's jobs are also criticized. That a job stand for "just over broke" or "jackass of the boss" and other blurbs. Many IBO's goals and dreams consist of ditching their job so they can sleep all day and live a life of luxury. Ironically, it is most IBO's jobs that continue to produce income so they can pay their bills and feed their family. It is also an IBO's job that funds their Amway and AMO expenses such as product purchases and functions and voicemail, etc. Without having a job, most people could not even join Amway or pay for any tools. Sadly, most IBOs won't make any money in Amway either, and will have to continue to work at their jobs. I do not believe that someone earning an honest living working a job is a loser. Ironically, the folks calling people losers are often not even netting a profit from their Amway business!

Yes, in this business or the sports world, there will be winners and there will be losers. The question is whether you are the one who is allowed to be the judge of who is and who isn't. I would also suggest that IBOs are completely shutting down potential future business by their behavior. What if I went to a store to purchase something but the item was not available on that particular day, so I don't purchase anything and leave. As I leave, the store owner says I am a loser for not buying something there. Will I go back? Very unlikely. If an IBO truly sees themselves as a store owner, all prospects should be seen as potential business, whether future or present. If your upline tells you that people not interested are losers, you should hand him a mirror.


Satish said...

Joecool, I like your posts. I am an active IBO, in fact a Q12 Platinum, but I like your blog. I wouldn't say that Amway is a scam. What makes the whole thing questionable is the intent of the associated organizations. I am a Q12 platinum who is not on standing order, my revenues are purely from retail. I always heard from my uplines that if you don't get on SOT and if you dont come to the functions, you can't go platinum.. Well, I decided to disprove it :) and I succeeded. Ever since I went 2500 PV without going to functions and discontinuing my standing order, I was almost shunned from the team. But what the heck... I didn't join the business for my uplines. I joined it for myself, so I decided to go ahead with it and get the job done!
We as a family have benefited greatly from the products and wouldn't say that the products are bad. Some products are definitely overpriced, some are a little pricey but hey you are being invited to be part of a business. So guess that's okay.
IBOs in South America have gone Diamond without a system, so it's not possible that you cannot go Diamond without the "System".

Anyways, i like your postes..

Joecool said...

So do you have downline are is everything purely retail? Which products do you most commonly sell?

Do you not get some interference from those still in the system?

Satish said...

Yes I do have downlines. I personally have benefited loads from a health perspective. and many of them in my team are those who have had similar experiences be it health or beauty or home care. We consume products personally as well but not because somebody forces us to, but because we like those products.
We retail a lot of Nutrilite (Perfect Pack, Weight Management/Inherent Health Genetic tests, Immunity Boosters.
Xs: Lot of restaurants and bars/night clubs use our products
Artistry and home care. Occasionally retail espring/atmosphere.

When I went 2500, i did so with 12 legs. Some of them who were like me stayed back with me and the others went with my uplines. Interestingly the 4 legs who came with me account for 90% of my volume :).

Nobody can interfere in your business without your permission right? Ever since I went Q12 and my lifestyle changed from being in $35,000 debt to owning a lexus and close to buying my own home, downlines from my other legs who did not quit yet have been asking if they can join back with me. My parents always taught me that it's okay to stand as a lone tree in the desert as long as you are standing for the right things. The day will come when you will provide shelter for the desert travelers :). There are organizations in BWW that are ethical. Don't want to take names but I know for a fact, there is a couple out of Dallas from Sri Lanka who are EDCs but have kicked out several platinums, emeralds and even a new Double Diamond from their mentorship because they did unethical things. When I was on standing order, I used to love listening to their cds for their wisdom. In fact the couple literally brought out one of their downlines from his death bed, back to life. There are people who do these things. Unfortunately, those people are in the 0.5% of Amway.
In fact on your posts, I think you should edit the picture that "Amway causes doom" and target the system at will. In India, from where I come, there are Diamonds in the recent past who came from backgrounds of making less than 5000 Rupees ($100) per month to making 10 lakh rupees per month (20,000 USD). That is a great achievement and Amway is a great vehicle that helped them accomplish that. And that's not just 1 such person, there are hundreds of them. For them, their entire legacy has changed! so Amway is certainly a great vehicle. I have nothing against Amway. but the system income and all that, is a mess!

Like I said, if you stand for the right things and know exactly what it is that you want, nobody can handcuff you. You can break the shackles and keep moving on!

Anonymous said...

'...Some products are definitely overpriced, some are a lttle pricey but hey you are being invited to be part of a business. So guess that's okay.?????'

what the hell? It's O.K. to be overpriced as long as you are 'being invited to be part of a business?' What kind of stupid logic is that?

Why is it we are only hit with foreigners these days announcing the 'wonderfullness' of amway?

You could not get away with being a platimun in the states w/o being on SOT. You would be ostricized right out of the business. The tools are how your upline cashes in.

And what does being a 'platinum' in India actually break out to? We already know diamond qualification in India and other countries are no where near the qualifications here in the states. Kinda shocking when you learn that little tidbit, huh? I overheard that from upline years ago and was stunned.

The on-stage kingpins kept beating us over the head with how wonderful India was and why weren't we willing to work as hard? And then, under her breath, we hear our upline platinum say the qualifications were a fraction our ours.

Oh, was I pissed! At that very moment, I lost all respect for amway and our diamonds.


Joecool said...

Satish, are you saying you are building an Amway business in India without the system?

Anonymous said...

Good and incisive responsive comments, Cassette Tape. And what is it with the phraseology thrown around all these years, unique to Amway-speak, that Amway is such a great "vehicle" (i.e., "business").

What it is, is a great big fat opportunity for legal plunder by sociopathic personalities, egged on by "godly men".


Ram said...

Hey Satish,

I am a new IBO in New York. I am currently two months with 150pv(mostly from my money) in and trying my best to stay with it but I don't think all the expenses are worth it. Such as communikate, standing order and so on. Frankly it just seems they are trying to get me addicted to cds and books. My recent expense was a $110 function ticket for a Maryland conference on the 10th which they promoted the hell out of, I mean really, it's like someone help a gun to their head.

Anyway what I am asking is what do you recommend for me? I am on a thin line between giving up because of all the expenses that I don't need. I mean really, why can't I have a choice not to use the voicemail system? I already have something else and it's FREE. Not only that, I need it to qualify for "dream team". Which is just outings with millionaires in the business and etc..

Joecool, feel free to share your thoughts too. I can use all the help I can get before it's too late.

Joecool said...

Ram, here's my thoughts. What is the likelihood that you will become profitable soon? And secondly, if you become profitable, will your downline end up losing money as you are now? Can you live with yourself knowing you are recruiting people to lose money so you can make a few bucks?

When you can answer these questions, you will have the answer to your own question. Thanks for commenting!

Anonymous said...

Ram, if you think that spending $110 for a function ticket is too much, my advice to you is to quit! Just quit man! You won't make it! In Amway only the strong survive. In any other business only the strong survive. Now really, is $110 that much? What about a Tony Robbins seminar where you have to spend $1000? Yes, there are people who spend that much and don't complain about it. Yet, here we have you who complains about 1/10th of that price? My guess is that you aren't really making money from Amway but hope that you'll be given money on a plate someday. That's the attitude of someone who's quick to complain about a $110 function ticket. So, save yourself the embarrassment and quit unless you're willing to stop whining and act as a mature business owner. What's better, going diamond or going critic?

Anonymous said...

^ looks like someone got bitten by the BS bug!

Anonymous said...

@Anon 12/1/2011 10:50AM
WOW, you people think you are business owners? You people don't know a thing about business. First mistake you do is integrate business with your personal lives. BIG MISTAKE. REAL Business men/women keep a business separate from their lives. In expense reports, business owners list their income from their businesses as expenses. The business may run at a loss but their personal bank accounts are not. We do not spend our own money, we spend the money EARNED from the business. There is a big difference between those two. In the starting years my REAL (NOT AMWAY) business was running at a loss, that is normal, but my bank account was not. I made sure I got paid from my business first then though about net profit. Do you even know the difference between Net Profits and Gross Profits? How much money from your bonus statements do have left over after paying for your "Business" related activities. Iam pretty sure you are using the income from your job to support your business, because your bonus statements are not enough to support it. STOP RUNNING AROUND IN SUITS PRETENDING TO BE BUSINESS MEN/WOMEN. "...only the strong will survive..."? Start playing in the real world and you will find out who is strong and who is weak.
For Ram, do you have money set aside to do this business? Money that you can loose and not think about it? If not, STOP wasting you money. $110 could have been used for alot of useful things.

Anonymous said...

Don't you just love it when ambots come on these blogs and tell us we're cheapskates? Too funny.

I don't intend to go to a Tony Robbins seminar for $1000 or even $1, so there goes your little theory right out the window. Once I learned how to play Uno I didn't need to go back and keep relearning it. Once you've heard the plan and learned how to show the plan, you don't need to keep going to meetings to learn how to share the plan. The meetings (of which I attended literally hudreds over many years) are nothing more than upline telling you what a winner you are (for doing nothing) and then finishing up with negative slam after negative slam against anyone who won't get in with you. Dump your friends. Dump your family. Weddings are overrated. Ahh....amway, the power of positive.

And, yes, $110 is a lot for the guy living in his car due to forclosure or job loss. It's a lot for the single mom working at Denny's trying to figure out how to make $25 buy Christmas for her little ones this year.

$110 is a lot of money to waste for anyone - no matter how wealthy.

amway's business plan is horrendous and when you ask your upline to see his Schedule C (that pesky little tax form that shows how much you netted after expenses - dang that pesky form!) his/her response is almost always without fail: what, did some lazy loser who didn't want to work hard tell you to ask me for that? I'll just bet it was a lazy loser, am I right? Are you going to listen to lazy losers, or follow me, a winner? blah blah blah. By the time he/she is done, you can't remember what you asked in the first place and now you're convinced that tax refunds are a good thing.

You go get 'em, Tiger. grrrrr


ST said...

The one thing that jumped out at me is that Satish says he sells xs in bars and nightclubs. I have run many bars and clubs over the years and I once had a "rep" for xs (before I knew it was amway) try to convince me to sell their product. I almost fell off my chair lauhing when they told me the cost. They were going to charge me more to purchase their products than I sold redbull for (which has a huge marketing and brand recognition) I would have had to sell it for about $9 a can, not exactly a great business move. They kept pushing the quality but it would have had to have been made of pure angel piss to be worth that much.