Monday, December 31, 2012

Amway Sounds Easy?

One of the reasons why upline and Amway presentations still manage to get people into the business is because the Amway opportunity is made to sound easy. Sure, the presenter of the plan might mention that it takes work, but prospects walking out of the meetings will get the impression that all they need is six, or that the task of going diamond is very manageable. It isn't until a prospect signs up and gets to work that he or she will find out how difficult it is to build an Amway business. In fact, the business in itself is not mind boggling, but overcoming the reputation issues that Amway has will doom most of the eager new IBOs.

Even seasoned IBOs who have been trained to counter attack people's objections about Amway will struggle when presented with the simple facts that Amway products are not necessarily the greatest and are not necessarily the best value. If this were true, Amway could move much more product simply by marketing these great products and selling them in stores. But since IBOs move and market Amway products for no salary and at their own expense, it's a great deal for Amway. I wonder what Amway sales would be if they did not count sales to IBOs for self consumption? Seems many of these IBOs will loyally buy Amway products while they are building the Amway business but that loyalty seems to fade once the dreams of early retirement and going diamond fades away.

One glaring problem that IBOs seems to ignore is how often platinums and high level IBOs like diamonds fall out of qualification. Yes, Amway has many new platinums, etc, but what about the people who worked their tails off just to end up falling out of qualification a year later? The income stops when your volume stops. There are countless stories of diamonds quitting or leaving Amway. IBOs should do some research and look for answers as to why this is. I think they would not like the answers. They will find that some diamonds are broke, in debt and struggling. In other words, diamonds are like the rest of the world, but have been elevated as special in the Amway world. Do you really think you can live a jetset lifestyle on 100K per year? Many people think $100K is great because they might earn far less, but $100K or $200K is really just a middle class lifestyle, and maybe less if the diamond is in debt because they show off a diamond lifestyle. Behind the smoke and mirrors of the diamond illusion, I think prospects would be shocked at how diamonds really live.

Amway may sound easy but the reality paints a very different picture. Go find out for yourself.

Friday, December 28, 2012

My Upline Has Credentials?

I recently read a comment from an Amway zealot. She mentions that someone's credentials must be considered when looking at information that is presented. I will comment that showing me a sports car or a fancy suit is not proof of financial success. Strange how they question credentials of everyone except their beloved leaders, some of whom told bold faced lies in the past.

I find this subject ironic because not one single upline leader, as far as I know, has ever supplied bonafide credentials about themselves. The audience assumes that the person on stage has high credentials, but do they really? Certainly, if someone is wearing a diamond pin for example, that this person has at least achieved the diamond level as recognized by Amway, but the level may not be current, and the level doesn't indicate the kind of income this person earns from Amway. Also, the diamond pin is one that is like a lifetime achievement, meaning you could have been diamond for 6 months in 1982 and never qualified again, but you can still wear the pin as you are still recognized as having achieved diamond status. I guess Joecool should be refered to as 4000 PV if that is the case.

What many people wrongly assume is that the diamonds buy homes and cars in cash, that they wake up at noon every day and participate in leisure activities all day while the cash rolls in. I have heard from some new IBOs, that their upline makes more money taking a crap in the morning than a critic makes in a whole year at a job. That IBO became quiet when some critics offered to take that bet. I doubt that any diamonds would take that bet.

But the truth of the matter is that as far as I know, only former diamonds have come clean about their Amway income. They are the only ones who spoke of credentials and accomplishments. Even critics of Amway will often openly speak about their experiences and achieved levels in the business. In the REAL business world, showing business tax returns and credentials are a normal part of doing business. It appears that only in the world of Amway is the supply of credentials and financial statements a big secret. Now I am not suggesting that IBOs or upline leaders should disclose their financials to the entire world, but certainly prospects and some downline should be able to see what their upline is doing financially, especially if that is the basis for purchasing their standing orders and function tickets. And I refer to business (Amway and Tools) income and expenses only, not from other personal sources.

I believe that IBOs and upline leaders do not disclose that information because it would not be beneficial to them. If it were, they would likely publish it freely, just as they flash around copies of checks. IBOs and prospects should take this to heart and ask upline the tough questions

Thursday, December 27, 2012

Your Chance At Amway Success - Less Than 1%?

Many people consider the platinum level in Amway as a significant achievement in Amway. While it may be nice to achieve that level and gain recognition from the Amway corporation, I will point out that there was a study done in Wisconsin where the attorney general analyzed and found that platinums on average, lost money. The study is somewhat dated, but I will also point out that today, there are MORE expenses associated with running an Amway business than before. (Voicemail, books, functions, standing orders, shipping). I would guess that it's possible that platinums lose more today than when the Wisconsin study was done.

A typical platinum group often has 100 or more downline IBOs. Thus a logical conclusion is that less than 1% of IBOs can reach that level. It is also, apparently rare to maintain that level. Factoring in people who quit, one can conclude that only a fraction of 1% ever reach platinum. My former upline diamond had 7 frontline platinums in his heyday. Actually, 6 of them were ruby level. None of them hold the platinum level today. So you have a less than 1% chance of reaching platinum and then you are unlikely to be able to maintain that level.

What serious prospective business owner would even consider opening a business where you have such a tiny chance of success? Even those who achieve platinum are likely to lose that level. If platinums cannot maintain their level, then it's easy to see why there are former diamonds as well. It seems that people are willing to take a chance on an Amway business because the start up cost is low. But what is the point of doing all of that when the chance of making money is negligible?

To compound the problem, many IBOs spend a lot of time and money building an Amway business that is unlikely to give them any return on their investment. I'd guess that the average serious IBO would spend $250 a month or more on tools. That money invested over a number of years in mutual funds would give you a much better chance of achieving some dreams. Even putting the money in the bank would make you better off than the vast majority of IBOs. A serious business owner would want to know their realistic chance of making money. For some strange reason, prospects and IBOs seem to ignore this reality. They dream of only the best case scenario or what is possible. They seem to ignore what is likely.

It is because uplines are in the business of selling tools and distributorships. They are not truly interested in your long term sustainable success. If you don't believe me, try to stop purchasing standing orders and function tickets and see how much longer you are edified and given help from upline. Seriously, would a real business owner be interested in a less than 1% chance of success?

Wednesday, December 26, 2012

Real Amway Success?

Success is subjective. Someone making ten dollars might be considered successful, for others, nothing less than a barrel of cash will suffice. One other important point is that there are undoubtably some very successful people in Amway. I am sure that some Amway diamonds are quite well off and enjoy some of the finer things in life. But the reality is that these successes are very very rare and many of these success apparently are not sustainable as many people are led to believe.

But the bigger issue in the Amway opportunity is where the success comes from. Sure, many people want to "go diamond" and live in luxury while barrels of cash roll in. But what is unknown to many, is that the few who enjoy the lifestyle and trappings do so at the expense of their downline. The downline move the volume and the downline purchases the system materials, both of which is profitable for the upline. Because Amway products, admittedly are not commonly sold to people who are not IBOs, then anyone can conclude that upline success comes from the pockets of the downline. Most downline would be better off writing a check for $100 each month to their upline and not participating in the business or buying products at all.

This in itself would not be such an issue if the system actually churned out new successes frequently AND if the downline were not led to believe that the system is the key to their success. But less than one half of one percent of IBOs ever reach platinum and out of those who do, only a tiny fraction of one percent ever attain the diamond level. But the business has tens of millions of people who tried and could never achieve what was promoted. Lack of effort may be a factor, but when that many people try and fail, it's evident that the system is flawed as well.

To summarize, it is possible for someone to achieve a level of success in Amway, but it is so difficult and so rare that IBOs probably have a better chance of winning the lottery or being struck by lightning than they do of achieving a significant level in the Amway business. Some people are successful, but it is usually at the expense of their downline. The catch is that uplines will teach their faithful downline IBOs that attending a function or buying a standing order is success, regardless of whether an IBO is earning a profit. So many IBOs think they're successful but they are simply fooling themselves with the help of their upline.

Success is undeniable, but sadly for the vast majority of IBOs, it is also unattainable, at least in the Amway opportunity.

Thursday, December 20, 2012

An Amway Retiree?

Check out this blog post from 2010 from an Amway and WWDB IBO. He is talking about retiring and now it is almost the year 2013 and I do not believe he is anywhere closer to retiring now than in 2010 because of his Amway business.

"Well we are coming up to Free Enterprise Day’s in Portland this weekend and with that I’ve come up to my one year anniversary. I’ve also passed the one year anniversary of this blog and where I started out with it. I started it while being a guest at Free Enterprise Day’s supporting Lindsay in what I had originally thought was something completely stupid, something illegal, something that was going to drive a wedge between us and our marriage. Turns out it was quite the opposite.

There is nothing wrong with a healthy scepticism and boy did I have a lot of “health” scepticism. After spending 5 months of doing some actual research, checking out the Amway site, Better Business Bureau, Checking the history of the company, Industry Canada, and yeah even checking out all the negative blogs out there, I came to the conclusion there was nothing wrong with this business and what it stood for. One of the biggest things that really drew me to business was the environmental stewardship this company stood on and I thought I could get behind that and have no problems promoting those great products. It was however the World Wide Dreambuilders that really intrigued me and instead of driving a wedge between our marriage it has helped solidify it even stronger than it was last year. How the heck could a business do that? Cause it’s founded on good core traditional values such as marriage, relationships, personal growth and living debt free. Not bad values if I do say so.

So I say one year because it’s one year when I joined my wife and we became united together and made a decision together to actually build this. Since then we’ve achieved some great milestones and have had some set backs, as with anything in life. We’ve been able to kill off a HUGE amount of consumer debt that we would have still had to this day if it were not for the great coaches, mentors we have. We’ve been able to ride the example our coaches have set out and we are pretty much right on track with where they are and that’s just the power of duplication. I’ve retired my wife so that she never has to give her 1st best to another man ever again. We will be able to raise our kids never having to know what a daycare or day home looks like. Not to offend anyone however that’s not how we want to raise our kids, we’d much rather instil our own values and be there every step of the way.

Looking forward to the future we are pumped to hit Double Eagle Ruby late next year at which time I’ll be stepping away from my job so that I never have to work for another man’s dream and give my 1st best to them. I know that we will work hard at this so that my kids will always have me at home when they need me and not have to wait for me to come home from work. I look forward to the days that we can take our kids out to the ski hill during the week day and not the weekend when it’s jam packed. I look forward to seeing my parents with the kids anytime we want instead of a set amount of vacation time or trying to stretch out a long weekend. There are so many things we look forward to in our second year in business and we know because of the great examples before us we will actually achieve them.

Now please don’t misunderstand me, these are our goals and things we want to achieve. I’m in no way saying you have to build this business. I’ve chosen this vehicle to obtain our goals and the vision we have set out for our family. You don’t have to agree with me and that’s perfectly fine. I only hope that you have a vehicle out there that will allow you to 100% achieve whatever it is you have set out for you and your family.

Here’s to year #2!"

Wednesday, December 19, 2012

My Amway Upline Is "Rich"?

This link lists the top 1000 earners in MLM. Some of the top earners are in Amway but they do not earn anywhere near the kind of income I thought they earned. My former upline leaders are listed but they make a fraction of what I though they made. My former upline diamond is not listed.

#667 was Crown Ambassadors Brad & Julie Duncan $40,000 per month or $480,000 per year. #702 was Crown Ambassadors Ron and Georgialee Puryear $40,000 per month or $480,000 per year. I did not see triple diamond Greg Duncan on this list.

While these are nice incomes, certainly more than I earn, but nowhere near the kind of income you would have expected from Crown Ambassadors. In fact, I would have been surprised if my upline diamond had only earned that much. I saw (at functions) slide shows of mansions, jets, fleets of sports cars and other luxuries that cannot possibly be purchased in cash (as many diamonds claim) and sustained. It was implied at many functions that these diamonds had so much money that they could shovel $100 bills into their furnace to keep them warm in the winter.

My former upline diamond once spoke of building his mansion in an exclusive gated community in Hawaii. He supposedly had purchased the land and was going to hire contractors to build the home. Last time I had checked (now many years later), my former upline diamond had not yet built the home and had moved from Hawaii to the State of Washington. I don't know the details of his life but I wonder what happened, considering the mansion was one of his "dreams".

Now I believe it's no secret that diamonds augment their income from selling tools such as voicemail, cds and seminars. But seriously, how much more can they earn in order to purchase mansions and jets?

It is my guess that the diamonds earn a nice income. However, the lifestyles they portray are not realistically achievable or sustainable at their levels, unless they were one of the top on the list, such as Dexter Yager.

Yes, some Amway diamonds appear to be rich, but that is a handful out of millions of IBOs. Do you believe you will ever be able to climb the mountain to out earn Dextar Yager or Bill Britt? The "average" IBO, according to Amway, earns $202 a month. I wonder what that average IBO earns if we remove the people from this top 1000 list?

Tuesday, December 18, 2012

Are You "Core"?

Here is a breakdodown of CORE and why it doesn’t work. Here are the CORE steps. Some groups may have variations of CORE, but this is generally what many groups use. CORE is allegedly the proven system of success. Apologists claims that people who are CORE for at least six months straight will succeed. I doubt it. There are many examples, including my former sponsor who can suggest it doesn't work.

1 - Show the Plan (10-15 per month)
2 - Retail the Products (10 customers @10 PV each)
3 – Tapes/cds
4 - Books
5- Functions (attend all)
6 - Accountability
7 - Counsel with Upline (Be teachable!)
8 - Buy 100% of your own products
9 – Communikate

Many upline will tell you that your success is nearly 100% guaranteed if you follow these steps for 2-5 years. Some Amway enthusiasts will tell you that 6 months of this activity will nearly assure you of a platinum level business. Certain steps are within the IBO’s control, such as reading every day and listening to cds, and attending functions. It is also easy enough to be accountable, counsel with upline, buy your own products, and use KATE (voicemail).

Here’s where an IBO’s efforts will break down. Showing the plan and retailing products. And remember, if you cannot do these steps then you are not considered “CORE” and your upline will likely tell you that it is your own fault and that you simply haven’t been CORE, therefore you did not achieve success. There is some truth in this but let me expose the system in a different angle.

Amway has a spotty reputation in the US. I don’t think anyone can dispute this fact. Therefore, for the vast majority of people, being able to show the plan 10-15 times per month is a nearly impossible task. If you are able to do this, you are a really good salesman or a good liar. In this scenario, the IBO is already successful, but not because of CORE, but simply because the IBO has the gift of being able to convince people into seeing the plan. But for many IBOs, they may contact hundreds of people and not be able to get anyone to see the plan. Even IBOs who follow upline advice on how to contact will probably not be able to show 10-15 plans per month. Thus this IBO, who is doing the work, will not be able to succeed. The system will blame the IBO, but the reality is that the IBO has too big of a disadvantage to overcome.

Secondly, with high prices (on average) and with a spotty reputation, most IBOs are unable to retail products. Amway itself has admitted that less than 4% of Amway products are sold to customers (non IBOs). Thus most IBOs are unable to sell products, therefore they are not CORE, therefore upline will blame the IBO for failure..

What if an IBO contacts 1000 people and cannot get 10 people to see the plan? Upline will claim that IBO is not CORE and therefore it is personal failure of the IBO. IMO, the only reason why upline can claim that CORE works is because in order to do the CORE steps consistently, you have to already be at a certain level of success. The vast majority of IBOs cannot and will never be able to reach that level.

That is the myth and the deception that many uplines will use to attract recruits. That each IBO can do the CORE steps. When only a fraction of 1% ever reach the level of platinum or higher, the numbers strongly support what is written here. Apologists are welcome to try and prove me wrong, but they can't.

Monday, December 17, 2012

Amway Friends For Life

You hang out with friends, generally people you like and have similar interests. You have good and bad times, but your true friends are there for you when you need them. You move residences, your friends are there to help you move. They may play a round of golf with you, or watch some sporting events, dinners, backyard barbeques, etc. These are folks you will likely end up retiring with and enjoying your golden years. Sure, circumstance may break apart some friendships. or moves made out of necessity. But these folks will likely remainas your friends for a long time to come.

But suddenly, you get enticed to join Amway. You see the "chance" to get rich, with a shortcut (not get rich quick, but a "shortcut"). You sign up and your sponsor is your new "best" friend. Most of the people you enjoyed being with think Amway is a questionable venture to get involved in. Suddenly, because of what you have been told or taught, you view these same nice people as "broke" or "losers", simply because they do not share the same ambition of untold wealth working 12-15 hours a weeek. Suddenly, your friends become prospects, or people you want to sponsor so you start recruiting them. Some may join, but most won't. Suddenly you are immersed in recruitment meetings, functions, and avoiding "negative", which is people and events that do not support your Amway business.

Now you are missing birthday parties, barbeques, and other social events. Your social events are now recruitment meetings, seminars and Amway business related events. You are taught that these events can be put off and your gratification delayed. You can do whatever you want when you go diamond. (Even though there may be only one (1) diamond out of every ten or twenty thousand IBOs) Your dedication will pay off right? Sadly, for most people, even very dedicated people, all they will see is losses on their yearly tax returns, mainly due to the purchase of cds, books, voicemail and function tickets. But these are your "friends" right?

Here's my take on it. Try missing a few meetings or functions. Stop buying cds and see how many "friends" remain from the business. It is likely that your upline will claim that you walked away from the friendship by slowing down on the "system". If that happens, then you have conditional friends, or fairweather friends. They are your "friends" while you are pursuing the same cause. They are your friends when you are attending functions. Are they there for you in bad times or are they your friends while you are buying tools and function tickets?

A short while after I attended my last function (I was still an IBO, just not a business builder), my dad passed away. Not a single one of my IBO "friends" bothered to attend the memorial service. Not a single one of my IBO friends called or dropped by the home to pay their respects. All of my "real" friends, who saw through the AMO smoke and mirrors called to talk to me and/or attended the memorial service.

Are your IBO friends conditional friends? Mine were.

Thursday, December 13, 2012

A Job Trading Hours For Dollars Or Amway - Trading Hours For Losses?

One of the ways that upline diamonds would put down jobs was to toss in the phrase that a job was simply trading hours for dollars. As if it were demeaning to have a job where you got paid for your time. I believe it's all relative. Being that many IBos are young and maybe working in more entry level types of jobs, then yeah, your hours wage might not be that great. If you earn say $10 an hour, then you might be struggling financially and it may take time before your skills and knowledge increase to a point where your experience is worth more money. What if you had a job paying $1000 an hour and earned $160,000 a month? Is that a lousy deal trading hours for dollars? I think not!

Conversely, having a business can be good or bad also. If you have an Amway business earning less than $100 a month and you spend $200 on functions, standing orders and other training and motivational materials, then you are losing money. You would be better off working for free. That is still a better alternative than working a business where you are losing money. I think most people agree that a platinum group typically has a 100 or more IBOs. Thus a platinum is in the top one half of 1% of all IBOs. I have heard that the platinum level is where you start to break even or make a little profit, depending on your level of tool consumption. If platinums are barely making a profit, then the other 99+% of IBOs are likely losing money. How much is that worth per hour?

I think uplines cleverly trick IBOs into thinking that a job is bad. Trading hours for dollars, afterall, sounds like some kind of indentured servant of sorts. But in the end, what matters is your bottom line. If you are an IBO with little or no downline, and/or not much in terms of sales to non IBOs/customers, then you are losing money each and every month if you are attending functions and buying standing orders. Your 10-12 hours a week of Amway work is costing you money! But if you spend 10-12 hours a week, even at minimum wage, then you might be making about 300 to 350 a month groww income. After taxes, you make about 250 to 300. At least trading hours for dollars gets you a guaranteed net gain at the end of the month.

Uplines trick you into a "business mentality" where you think that working for a net loss is just a part of business. IBOs should realize that a business promoted as low risk and no overhead should be one where you can profir right away. Instead, IBos are taught to delay gratification, or to reinvest any profit back into their business in the form of tools and functions, which results in a net loss. If that's the case I would choose trading hours for dollars.

Remember, trading hours for dollars is not a bad deal if you are making enough dollars per hour. And even those who make less, are better off that those who "run a business" but end up with a net loss. It's all relative and hopefully, this message will help new or prospective IBOs who are being enticed to join the Amway business opportunity. Good luck to those with jobs and those with businesses. You can be successful either way. Remember that!

Tuesday, December 11, 2012

Joecool's 4000 PV Experience

I wanted to give people a glimpse into what it was like at the 4000 PV level and what my experience was. Although Amway and WWDB apologists will claim this doesn't happen, or that it doesn't happen anymore, I have reasons to believe that very little has changed in WWDB since I was an IBO. The only major difference was that we did call in and product pick up back then. Apparently, some WWDB leaders still talk about buying homes in cash and teaching the same old stuff.

How many hours per week did I work? I would say up to 30 hours a week was spent on business related issues. Granted, product pick up consumed an entire afternoon and evening, generally on Thursdays. I would have to call in my order to the platinum and then pick up the stuff on Thursday afternoon. Then I had to rush home and distribute the stuff to my downline. My upline platinum was not good at filling orders so it was a real pain. I'd say pick up and associated paperwork costed me maybe 8 hours a week. One good benefit today is that Amway issues the bonuses. In the old days, you as an upline had to do so. (This is an area where I agree that Amway made good progress) I did hear though, that WWDB still has call in and pick up for standing orders and such. If this is true, then they undid the progress that Amway had made. Also, as a up and coming leader, my platinum expected me to absorb some of the cost of returned tools, such as absorbing losses if someone on standing order quit. (Brad Duncan cut a true north tape at the time that basically said IBOs absorb the cost of standing orders for downlines who quit)

As a 4000 pin, I had to show the plan or attend plans for my frontline, if the platinum was showing the plan. I'd say 4 nights per week we showed the plan for a downline or a downline in depth. Of course after the plan, we might "hang out" with downline and have some night owl teaching. Some people call this association or whatever. Depending on the length of the drive, this might take 3-4 hours 4 nights per week. Sometimes it was shorter when you had no shows.

We counseled with downline and upline. I spent some individual time with my upline and also with downline who wanted one on one time to get ideas on how to improve their Amway business. We looked over their group parameters and of course, tools flow. There was a WWDB counseling sheet for this purpose. Looking back, I"m not sure what this really accomplished except for the big pins to know which leaders are selling the most tools.

Then we had open meetings and functions. One local function each month and generally one or two open meetings where a diamond or emerald would show the plan. Of course, my sponsor (platinum) did not feel right unless he augmented our function with his own night owl meetings. We also had three long distance functions on the mainland. These functions were (at the time) called Leadership, Family Reunion and Free Enterprise day. Being from Hawaii, these functions costed me, as a single, at least $1,000 or more for each trip because it was airfare during peak travel times, hotel, rental cars and the function ticket. I hate to think what couples paid.

Because of my status as up and coming leader, I had the privilege of attending special meetings where our diamond would teach or show house plans. I even had the honor or driving the diamond to a house plan. Damn, how can anyone live without such an honor?

For my troubles, I had a business at 4000 PV, with eagle parameters. I was considered a "mover and shaker". Lots of people knew me and my sponsor wanted so badly to break a downline platinum. He sat down with me one afternoon and told me I could really push to platinum and ruby easily if I would only ditch my girlfriend (fiancee' at the time). He told me that he would ditch his wife if the upline diamond told him to do so. He said a single (ruby or higher) could easily attract a lot of eligible women. It was after that meeting when I decided to quit.

I had reached 4000 PV. I was making very little or losing some money because of the tools and functions. I did not see prospects of making money even at platinum and now my upline wanted control of my life. I told my group the truth and all of them quit except 1 or 2 of them who were brainwashed enough to stay involved. That was my story and I have no regrets about my decision to quit. I truly hope this story helps a prospect or a current IBO.

Monday, December 10, 2012

Attend "All" Functions?

One of the things Amway defenders will spout is how tools are optional in the Amway business. While Amway says this, many Amway AMO leaders do not. One of the things I remember hearing was how an IBO "needed" to attend "all" functions. So many IBOs asked the upline questions such as what if by brothers is getting married and the wedding is on the sAme day as a function? Or what if my kid has a soccer game or an event that was scheduled on the same day as a function? The answer from upline was simple. "All means all".

So upline may teach you that God is #1, spouse is #2, kids #3, job #4 and Amway is a distant #5. That's what they said but that isn't what they meant. Anytime there was a conflict with anything, I heard the same thing: "all means all". Meaning that one needed to attend all functions. Amway defenders are quick to jump in and claim this doesn't happen or that they have never heard it, yet I continue to see stories and testimonies indicating that this is still happening in most of not all AMO groups. Sure some upline might be more lenient than others, but in the end, it seems that most uplines want their downlines to attend all functions, regardless of whether an IBO is profitable or not.

I recall even an IBO who had worked hard and was not profitable. He was given the same answer about "all means all". Some upline want you to believe that hard work equals success, but in Amway, hard work doesn't guarantee success. And I believe it is because an Amway IBO is basically a commissioned salesperson amd in that kind of business, hard work can go unrewarded. It is not a matter of working hard, and even working hard and smart can go unrewarded at times. It is because Amway's prodcuts are difficult to sell and Amway IBOs previously unthethical behavior makes it hard to find people who are interested in Amway. Thus even finding someone willing to see the Amway sales plan is a great challenge.

What does your upline say about attending meetings and functions? Do they advise you to pick and choose the ones you can afford or do they tell you that you should attend "all". Do they look at your business profitability before advising you to do they ask you to trust their guidance and leadership? Do they also advise you to buy other tools in the same manner? That is advising you to be on voicemail or standing order without knowing about your business parameters? Do they really want your auccess or their own? Keep in mind that some upline make much more money from tools than from Amway. What say you now?

Wednesday, December 5, 2012

Amway IBOs Choose To Succeed?

Many IBOs seem to think that success in business or in other aspects of life is simply a choice. They mistakenly believe that you can actually choose to succeed or not. They apparently believe that persistence and choosing to win will eventually land them a premiere spot at diamond club. If that were truly the case, wouldn't we see hoards of new diamonds each and every year? Instead, we see one here and one there, and while there are a few new diamonds in the US every so often, we see others quitting, dropping out or leaving Amway for greener pastures. Make you wonder if the prize is worth pursuing in the first place.

But IBOs and information seekers should understand quite clearly. You cannot simply "choose" to win or succeed. In a football game, both sides can believe and choose to win, but still, only one can be the victor. In Amway, it is common for a platinum to have 100 to 200 downline. Thus to be a platinum, you need to be in the top one half of one percent of IBOs. To be a diamond, you will need to be in the top 600 to 1200 IBOs, not counting the masses of IBOs who register and do nothing or register and do a little and quit. Only one in about ten to twenty thousand will ever reach diamond in North America.

Sure, IBOs may cite some touching story like "Rudy". Basically a nobody who dreamed of playing for Notre Dame. He busted his butt and did whatever it took to make the team and the movie ends with him getting in a game, making a sack and being carried off the field by his teammates in a blaze of glory. A great and inspiring movie. But what you don't see is the possible tens of thousands of young men who had the same dream, may have worked every bit as hard but circumstances and situations prevented them from achieving the same limited success. Uplines want you to think these kinds of stories can happen to everyone, but the fact is that there is only a little room at the top. If stories like Rudy were common, then there would have been nothing special about it. An elite athlete like a Michael Jordan or a Tiger Woods only comes along once or twice in a lifetime. It is like achieving diamond. It happens but it is a rare occasion, especially in North America where Amway appears to be shrinking instead of growing.

In the Amway business, many prospects and IBOs are motivated and driven to succeed. Many of them are fine young men and women who want more in life. But the vast majority of those who try will not achieve their dreams via the Amway opportunity no matter how hard they work and no matter how badly they want it. The reason is because there are too many variables that are not in direct control of the IBO. The Amway reputation in North America is spotty at best so sponsoring downline is nearly impossible. And when you can sponsor, chances are your downline will do little or nothing. Many new IBOs will work hard, but quit because they are faced with the challenges I just mentioned. And even if you can overcome the overwhelming odds, you still need to keeping working hard constantly to maintain the business, all for an unstable average diamond income of $146,995, which doesn't consider taxes, medical insurance and other perks you may receive at a job. All told, I believe the diamond income is not all it's cracked up to be when you consider the charade you must play to display the diamond lifestyle. Do the math and you will be able to see for yourself.

In the end, it seems as though the prize isn't as great as it seems, and the trail to success is one that most cannot endure. And even if you achieve diamond, you can lose it quite easily as others have discovered. The bottom line is that you cannot simply choose to succeed in Amway or any other endeavor. Good luck if you decide to attempt it anyway.

Tuesday, November 27, 2012

The Amway Opportunity?

Over the years I have been debating with Amway supporters, I cannot see what is so great about the Amway opportunity. Are some of these Amway defenders that stupid or dense that they truly believe that a business where one out of a few hundred people might make a profit and most of the remaining IBOs will lose money is a good opportunity? I'm not talking about people who sign up and "do nothing". Many IBOs sign up and put in a great deal of time, effort and money, only to find out that the system simply does not work (especially in the US) and they make a business decision to quit and/or to do something else.

Of course there are some people who make money in Amway. If nobody made money, then the opportunity would cease to exist. But it is basically exploitation of the downline that accounts for upline success. Amway's admission that sales to non IBOs are low, confirms this. Thus certain upline make their income from their downline's PV volume, and on tool purchases. I mean even a lottery has winners. Even ponzi schemes and other questionable opportunties have some winners. This is not to suggest that Amway in not legal. Amway is perfectly legal, but the way the opportunity is set up, those who profit, primarily do so at the expense of their trusted downline.

There are no groups that I know of where all the IBOs can win and earn a profit. I would guess that there might be a few rogue groups who only focus on retail sales, and while these groups can be profitable as a group, they are few and far between. This is because most IBOs fall under an LOS such as WWDB, BWW, LTD or N21, and these groups all seemingly focus on recruiting of new IBOs. Yes, they may sprinkle in some suggeestions about selling goods, but generally speaking, their "training" materials consist of motivation speeches, feel good stories (whether true or not), and the theme of never quitting while continuing to purchase more tools.

Some upline have the nerve to start teaching downline that their Amway business is not about making money, but to save your marriage, make you a nicer person, or some other diversion to make you forget that you are losing money month after month after month. Some groups even mix in religion and politics into their functions and meetings. As far as I can see, the typical business buildiing IBO signs up, gets some of the tools and attends a few functions, and finds that the products are hard to sell because they are not priced competetively with other retailers, and that a damaged reputation is nearly impossible to overcome. These IBOs realize they are not going anywhere, and they walk away, chalking up the losses as a life lesson. But apparently, many uplines who lied and deceived in the past are continuing to do so today, often just revising history for their benefit (i.e. lying about making any profit on tools).

Many IBOs, prospects, information seekers and critics read this blog. My question is very simple. What is so great about the Amway opportunity? For most, it is just a bad use of time and money. While some may exist, I don't know of a single person who "did the work once" and sat back collecting barrels of Amway money while sipping Mai Tais on the beaches of Jamaica. I see crown ambassadors working as hard today as they did many years ago. Diamonds losing homes to forclosures, a prominent diamond in bankruptcy proceedings, and a hoard of WWDB diamonds apparently selling off mansions that they allegedly paid for in cash. (It os quite possible that their lifestyles are simply not sustainable).

Where is the benefit in the business for the typical IBO? Just as there are some diamonds, there are lottery winners. Displaying a lottery winner doesn't make it prudent to spend your money on lottery tickets. Displaying a diamond's lifestyle doesn't make Amway a good opportunity. While Amway is a business and not a game of chance, the results of either, sadly are eerily similar - that is a few winners and millions of non winners.

What is so great about the Amway opportunity? I don't see it.

Monday, November 26, 2012

The Psychology Behind Amway?

I’m not sure whether this plan was carefully crafted out or whether it just evolved, but the way some uplines show the plan is cleverly designed to suck people into their systems. If you aren’t aware or careful, it’s easy to get caught up in the excitement of the presentation. The presentation is full of deception and I will try to point out these items in my analysis.

The speaker may talk about how he once thought he was “doing okay” in life. That he was making a living and able to meet his financial obligations. But he thought there might be more. One day he saw the plan and it changed his life. He did not realize he had gotten into a rut of going to work and going home every day and looking forward to his 2 weeks off each year. (This is relatable for many) That time and money are so important in life. Control of time and money is the key to success. Many people have lots of money but work all day and nite. Or people have time but are broke and can’t do much. The speaker might mention dreams or goals such as having an extra $500 a month or more. What would you do for an extra $500 a month. What about an extra $50,000 a year? Wouldn’t it be nice to have the wife stay home with the kids instead of leaving the family to go to work? Like the “Leave it to Beaver” days? (This gets the women excited)

The speaker will likely mention something about the economy and how prices always go up. The speaker may mention the 4 “I’s” that suck money out of your paycheck. The four I’s are Interest, Income Tax, Insurance and Inflation. The speaker may talk about how the government will take their cut and so on until you get your “net”. The speaker may mention how so many Americans are dead or broke by age 65, and that social security will collapse. (This instills fear in many people).

The speaker might also go on to mention how so many marriages are falling apart in the US because of financial stress. That couples work so hard that they have no family time and it hurts marriages. That people work so many hours these days that they are married to their desks. The “manager” of the office is the first one there and the last one to go home. That despite all of this work and effort, people are falling into debt. Credit cards maxed out, loans, trying to keep up with the Joneses. (Many people can relate to this)

But now, because he was looking for opportunity/open minded one day, he saw an opportunity. This opportunity changed his life and can do the same for you! The speaker now wakes up at the crack of noon. His wife stays home with him and the kids. They take nice vacations and they do what they want when they want. (Of course, who doesn’t? But is this true?) The opportunity takes advantage of the internet and allows you to leverage your time and money so that you can create a residual walk away income. (But nobody walks away do they?)

This is approximately the point in the presentation where they mention “Amway” At this point, the speaker will defend Amway, stating that if you can make money, does it matter.? If you can save money, does it matter? The speaker may go into the product line and mention partner stores and will likely show a 6-4-2 plan or a variation of it. In every case, they will show a best case scenario, not what is likely. Many prospects will leave thinking “all I need is six”. They don’t understand how unlikely it is to sponsor six platinums and there is no mention of the retention rates, the income most IBOs can expect, and firm questions will be deflected to the prospect’s inviter. The speaker may also discourage you from speaking to friends and family as they may have a bad experience but the diamond is successful and knows more about Amway than your family and friends.

Joe’s commentary: So the speaker becomes very relatable from the start. His situation in life will be like many in the audience. He will talk about doing okay,. But wanting more or looking for more. He talks about debts and many in the audience will also relate. They get people to think about dream cars or vacations. He talks about walk away income, but doesn’t mention that very very few ever make significant money and apparently, not many actually walk away either. They say you will make money and save money by doing the business. It’s hard to argue against that,.except most people will not make money or save money. In fact most people, if they participate fully or partially in the training system, they will lose money. For the dedicated IBOs, many of them LOSE LOTS OF MONEY. The plan is crafted out to sound sensible and relatable, but many IBOs will give it a try and shortly after, will realize that the system doesn’t work, that the reputation of Amway IBOs is soiled and sponsoring people or even getting people to see the plan is a barrier that most people simply cannot overcome. At least if you know what’s going on, you may be able to avoid the trap.

Friday, November 23, 2012

Amway Diamonds Live A Life Of Leisure And Freedom?

When I was an IBO, I often saw my upline diamond driving around town dressed in a business suit. I used to think why does he keep working if he can walk away and collect residual income? My sponsor told me that the diamond only works because he cares about his downline and wants to help them. So there are two possible scenarios, the diamond is working to help his downline out of a genuine concern, or possoibly he is working because he has to! The only difference now is that the diamond works the nite and/or graveyard shift, because many IBOs are building the business after they complete their day jobs. **We should also note that my former upline diamond dropped down to the emerald level around 2005 and has since re-established his diamond level.

Now Amway has stated that the average diamond earns about $146,000 a year. That is a decent income, but after taxes and paying for basic expenses such as medical and dental insurance, the average diamond probably lives a very middle class lifestyle. Keep in mind that a large portion of a diamond's income comes in the form of an annual bonus, thus a diamond's monthly income may be quite small. Yes, diamonds may have other sources of income such as speaking engagements and income from standing orders and functions. But this income depends on the diamond's continued appearances and efforts.

So is it likely that a diamond is "free"? I would have to conclude that a diamond is not free, and may actually have to spend more time maintaining his group than if the diamond simply had a 9-5 job. For one thing, a diamond needs to maintain a personal group to keep qualifying for bonuses. With a poor retention rate in Amway, I am fairly sure that a diamond spends much time recruiting personally sponsored IBOs to maintain this group. Additionally, a diamond must help his six or more groups of downline platinums to maintain their businesses or face the possibility of falling out of qualification. My former diamond dropped down to the emerald level but has since re-qualified at diamond. A diamond must also dedicate time to reward up and coming movers and shakers, to keep them motivated. I got to spend time with my upline diamond when I was considered a promising up and coming pin.

In order to continue to receive tools income, a diamond must also travel to numerous functions and speaking engagements. Although the tools income allegedly doubles a diamond's income, it also adds a lot of expenses, especially if the diamond and his family travel first class to show off the diamond lifestyle.

After breaking down projected income and considering projected expenses, I can only conclude that a diamond probably lives a middle to upper middle class lifestyle, and probably works as much as a man with a 9-5 job, except that a diamond works nites and weekends. A good portrait of this is shown in Ruth Carter's book (Amway Motivational Organizations: Behind The Smoke and Mirrors). In the book, the diamond had a net income of over $300,000, but lived in debt, could barely pay his mortgage, and was always on the run from one function to the next.

I believe that diamonds may actually be busier at the diamond level than an average Joe who has a 9-5 J-O-B. The difference is that the diamond works the night shift. Is this the freedom you are seeking?

Tuesday, November 20, 2012

Amway IBOs Justify Themselves?

Other than the Amway opportunity, I cannot think of any business where sales people or IBOs feel a need to justify their lack of success. I hear all kinds of crazy things such as how an IBO's involvement in Amway saved a marriage or how an IBO has become a better person as a result of being in the Amway business. Now if your involvement in Amway did indeed save your marriage or made you a better person, that is a great side benefit. But the Amway opportunity is supposed to be a business and a business exists to make a profit. This is something that IBOs seem to overlook when they are involved.

I believe these "side benefits" are mentioned by upline as a diversion away from the fact that these IBOs aren't making any money. My upline used to say you get in for the money but you stay in for friendships. They may also use the line that the Amway opportunity is not get rich quick. I believe that is because the upline wants you to stay in and expect you to purchase tools for a while. They want you to think that the business is not not actually making money and that you are supposed to lose money in the beginning, even if the business was not presented that way when you were recruited.

But a very important question is why IBOs need to constantly justify their lack of success? Is it a good idea to be involved in an opportunity where you aren't turning a profit and need to justify the lack of success? Many IBOs blame themselves despite the fact that your upline may have asked for your trust and blind loyalty. You do what you are told but the upline leaders never take responsibility for an IBO's failure. It like playing a game of heads I win and tails you lose. I know of IBOs who worked very hard and did what upline advised, only to see net losses.

If you are new in the business, nobody expects you to be making a fortune overnite, but certainly a business that promotes low or no overhead and a low start up cost, why shouldn't you be able to turn a profit within a few months? The cost of your "tools" should not exceed any income you are earning. If you attended a function and your sales don't increase, why attend the next one? If you are buying standing order and your volume stays the same, is that cd helping your business?

Why do IBOs have to resort to rationalizing themselves with claims of concentration and/or quality? Apparently the general public doesn't agree, based on the low sales to non IBOs. Seems the only ones who see a benefit in regular consumption of Amway goods are IBOs, who are hoping to reap financial rewards for doing so. Either your business is growing or it's not. No amount of justifying or rationalizing will change your bottom line. I just hope more IBOs and prospects will see this before it is too late.

Monday, November 19, 2012

Is Success In Amway Likely Or Not?

One thing that many Amway promoters don't like to talk about is what your realistic chances of success are. I will define success as Diamond because that is what the outcome of the 6-4-2 and 2-5 year plan. Of course you may be able to earn some income at lower levels, but my understanding is that diamond is where the real money from Amway and the tools start rolling in. And I can also understand why people promoting Amway do not discuss your realistic chances of winning. Afterall, lottery promoters do not show you the millions of losers, they only parade the winners in front of you.

Many people, including Amway enthusiasts will agree that many IBO do little or nothing. Some people never even place an order or make any attempt to do any business. For the purpose of this article, I am not speaking about these folks. I am talking about people who actually put in some effort to the business.

For many people who want to make an earnest effort, they will purchase and hopefully sell a few items with the goal of reaching 100 PV. For that effort, you will receive approximately $10 from Amway and whatever profit you might have earned by selling products. Here's the catch. You will likely need to pay website fees in excess of the $10 you earn from Amway. For the more dedicated IBOs, you may be payin for voicemail, standing orders, book of the month, and possibly attending functions. These expenses will exceed your income month after month unless you are able to increase your volume by selling enough products and/or sponsoring downline who buy and sell products.

Because Amway has to include the IBO bonuses in their prices, the products come at a premium price. Thus sales to non IBOs are relatively low. Without sales to non IBOs, the only other way to generate more volume is to sponsor people who will buy and sell products. But due to past unethical IBO behavior, getting people to see the Amway sales and marketing plan may be a challenge. Also, most IBOs are unable to sponsor a single downline.

Some Amway enthusiasts will claim that if you do their CORE steps for 2-5 years consistently, that you are likely to succeed. Sound easy, but becaue of the factors I have identified, some of these steps are impossible to do consistently. It's not like walking a mile each day where you have control of each step. People will likely fail in showing the plan and sponsoring others because they cannot find enough people who are willing to see an Amway plan. Many, possibly most other IBOs can and will do certain steps consistently such as listening to a CD daily and reading a success book. But because of a spotty reputation in the US, IBOs will very likely fail to be able to show enough plans and sponsoring downline in order to succeed.

Your realistic chance of success? My informed guess is less than 1 tenth of 1 percent. That's the likelihood of going diamond. Your chance of going platinum? My informed guess will be less than 1/2 of 1 percent. If you think you can beat those odds, go for it. For most people, it might be wise to look into other opportunities.

Friday, November 16, 2012

Why Tools Are Needed In Amway??

As an IBO, I was told that I "needed" to attend all functions. Attending all functions meant "all" is what I was told. Brad Duncan once had a tape in the true north series where he said that downline should not cancel standing orders even when IBOs quit, because there would then be an urgency to replace that person. I was in WWDB and while not everyone in WWDB may have taught this, our group was told that we should purchase 5-7additional tapes/cds in addition to standing order because we needed to listen to new material daily and because we should be passing out these materials as they will sponsor new people. To date, I do not know of anyone who passed out a tape or cd and had someone decide to join the Amway business as a result of listening to that tape or cd.

When I was in the business (In WWDB), our group was told that WWDB was a non profit organization. That was quickly retracted, but still, the WWDB leaders stood on stage in front of tens of thousands of IBOs and said nobody made a profit from tools. We now know that it was a lie. We also know that many of these leaders are still teaching, and as far as I know, not a single WWDB leader has ever been accountable for these lies. Some of these lies may have caused untold financial damage to downline. I'm certain I would have been less dedicated to tools if I had known that some uplines made most of their income from tools and that their advice was a conflict of interest. Some Amway defenders are currently talking about how some negative misinformation about Amway is hurting their business, but ironically, it would appear that most damage to Amway has been done by IBOs themselves, such as tricking people to meetings. As far as I know, not a single person has ever been held liable for the financial damages to downlines and former IBOs who lost money by being told lies about Amway.

Now I also would like to emphasize that I do not believe the tools work and do not produce any results. While Amway defenders will claim that most if not all new emeralds and diamonds are on the system, they fail to mention that there are also tens or hundreds of thousands of people who work the system without results. As far as I know, there is no bonafide unbiased evidence that suggests that the system produces any results. It is why IBOs end up later talking about being a nicer person of how their marriage was strenghthened by joining the system. While these are nice side benefits (if true), these reasons are not why you started a business. A business exists to make a profit, yet uplines make all kinds of excuses as to why IBOs did not profit, even placing the blame on the IBOs who trusted them.

It brings me to the real purpose of having tools. The REAL purpose of tools is to make profits for your upline. I believe the tools were invented as a way to motivate and train new and distance IBOs, but apparently, GREED eventually set in and many uplines started emphasizing tools, not because they wanted downline success, but because their tool businesses were wildly successful with thousands of captive downline dedicated to the system. I believe it is why I saw many IBOs who worked hard, never missed a meeting or function, did nto sponsor any downline, but were still told they needed more and more tools.

I believe the real purpose of having tools is so your upline's tools business can be profitable.

Wednesday, November 14, 2012

Amway Financial Freedom Or A Myth?

Financial Freedom! That was one of the major battle cries when I was recruited for the Amway business. You gain control of time and money by creating residual or passive income. That is true financial freedom. You wake up at noon, no job, and just do whatever you please, whenever you please. I remember the speaker saying that broke/unemployed people also had freedom, but it was different because they were broke and could not afford to go golfing or do other activities that required money on a regular basis.

I am assuming that this is still the case for many IBOs. Of course, upline leaders may toss in a disclaimer that you don't get rich quick as an IBO, but the pitch apparently still contains the financial freedom and residual income theme, based on my experiences with IBOs. IBOs still think they will be rich. Also, 2-5 years sounds like "get rich quick" to me.

But hey, financial freedom would be a great thing, don't get me wrong. Who wouldn't want to be 35 years old with enough cash to never have to work again? I mean I could spend some time imagining how fun that would be. It would also be fun to imagine what you would do with all the cash if you hit the powerball lottery as well. But for the starry eyed IBOs, I simply have a few questions for you to ponder. A few realistic questions that you should be asking yourself. The answers to these questions will tell you a lot.

1. Who in your group or upline truly has achieved financial freedom? Have you seen their financials or simply a display of wealth such as mansions and fancy cars? Mansions and fancy cars could just be a massive pile of debt. Not too long ago, there apparently were diamonds who had their homes foreclosed, and a triple diamond who was in bankruptcy proceedings. Find out if anyone in your group/upline has actually achieved the success that they are using to recruit you. Also, if they are financially free, why do they work at function after function? Traveling and speaking might not be a traditional job, but it is still work, nonetheless.

2. Even if you find someone who is retired and golfing everyday because of Amway residual income, ask yourself what the likelihood is that you will be able to achieve the same results. If diamonds are still working, what chance do you have of success if you are new or experienced in Amway, and have few or no downline. More than likely, your chance of winning the lottery will be greater than your chance of achieving a significant residual income from your Amway business. Also, I don't know of any Amway retirees who built their business once and walked away with any significant residual income from Amway. Do you?

Tuesday, November 13, 2012

WWDB IBO Retiring Soon?

This is a repost of an article I did last year. This IBO "named it and claimed it: that he would be retiring in November 2011. It's now a year later. Examining his blog makes me think he's lost a lot of steam. He did not even post an article about 2012 FED. I wonder if he retired or quit?

I've been following the journal of an IBO who is in the WWDB LOS. Essentially, I believe the dude is hard working and wanting the best for his family. The problem I see is that he has apparently fallen for the deception that was and continues to be taught by WWDB. Pro Amway folks have criticized Joecool because they say my experience is old and outdated. Yet, here it is on the journal of a current WWDB IBO, pretty much verifies that the same material taught in the late 1990's is still taught today. The only difference I see is that the WWDB leaders are not lying about nobody making a cent of profit from tools. Although they have their own spin on that as well.

Ironically, his website says "Sto Pro Veritate", which means "I stand for the truth". I would guess that Shaun believee what his upline says is the truth but his blog is littered with material that is dicey, but because his upline said so, Shaun believes. I was once there myself, but realized the scam after a number of months. Sometimes it's hard to discern because your sponsor or upline is often a friend or family member. They get you to agree on various issues to build a degree of trust and slow up your level of commitment. Shaun is a perfect example of this.

Basically, Shaun's wife got involved and eventually, Shaun also jumped in. The couple went 1000 PV in March 2010 and even posted copies of their checks. Nothing indicating further progress has been posted since. I would assume any new pin level would have been an article that was newsworthy on such a blog. Lately, there has been more mundane material, and Shaun does not allow comments on his blog anymore, which in itself is interesting. Shaun, in 2009, posted that why wouldn't someone want to work hard for 2-3 years and never have to do it again? 2012 is around the corner, about 3 years since he got started. Food for thought.

Some of the interesting things that can be found on the blog:

The couple plans to purchase a home in cash.
Denied that Greg Duncan (One of their mentors) had bankruptcy issues
Amway/WWDB IBOs have a 2% divorce rate compared to 60% for the rest
Will be Double Eagle Rubies making $117K in 2011
Will be job optional in November 2011
Debt Free (True, but sold their home and cashed in 401K to do so)

Here's a recent quote: "We’ve got some pretty big dreams and today the dream of owning an aircraft was at the forefront. Don’t laugh, get your own dream!"

**Now let me say I wish Shaun and his family well. I hope he does succeed and is able to fulfill his goals and dreams, but not exclusively at his downline's expense. What troubles me is how the leadership at WWDB is apparently teaching him the same junk I saw as an IBO and is filling his heart with false hopes and dreams that are unlikely to ever come to fruition. Even the miniscule number of people who do succeedin Amway, do so at the expense of their trusting downline. Seems that Amway accreditation did nothing to alter or shape the teaching of these LOS's. I will continue to follow his progress and hope that he will eventually see through the facade.

Friday, November 9, 2012

Winners Versus Losers?

One of the things that my upline taught, and I believe is still taught today in various groups is that winners join Amway and losers do not. Or that you were a winner because you were doing something to better your financial future and those who didn't were losers. or broke minded. Of course the upline who said this had no knowledge about those who were not in Amway. Some of them may already have been financially sound or may have been doing something to better their financial future. I'm not sure why these uplines, who promote "positive", had to resort to calling people losers simpy because they did not agree that Amway was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

In many games or sporting events, there will be someone or a team that wins the game and someone or a team that loses the game. Losing a game doesn't make you a loser and certainly, a team that wins the game would not say the losing team were losers. Can you imagine a pro football team's coach taking the podium after a game and saying his team won because the other team was a bunch or broke minded gutless losers? That would never happen, yet we see that frequently in the Amway/IBO world. The owner of Amway, Rich DeVos had once said in a recorded message that just because people do not agree with you (paraphrased) about Amway, does not make them losers and that IBOs should not call people losers.

In all of this, people's jobs are also criticized. That a job stand for "just over broke" or "jackass of the boss" and other blurbs. Many IBO's goals and dreams consist of ditching their job so they can sleep all day and live a life of luxury. Ironically, it is most IBO's jobs that continue to produce income so they can pay their bills and feed their family. It is also an IBO's job that funds their Amway and AMO expenses such as product purchases and functions and voicemail, etc. Without having a job, most people could not even join Amway or pay for any tools. Sadly, most IBOs won't make any money in Amway either, and will have to continue to work at their jobs. I do not believe that someone earning an honest living working a job is a loser. Ironically, the folks calling people losers are often not even netting a profit from their Amway business!

Yes, in this business or the sports world, there will be winners and there will be losers. The question is whether you are the one who is allowed to be the judge of who is and who isn't. I would also suggest that IBOs are completely shutting down potential future business by their behavior. What if I went to a store to purchase something but the item was not available on that particular day, so I don't purchase anything and leave. As I leave, the store owner says I am a loser for not buying something there. Will I go back? Very unlikely. If an IBO truly sees themselves as a store owner, all prospects should be seen as potential business, whether future or present. If your upline tells you that people not interested are losers, you should hand him a mirror.

Thursday, November 8, 2012

You Didn't Try Hard Enough?

One of the things IBOs are taught is to blame themselves for is not working the business hard enough or not doing things right, exactly as upline advised. Actually, nothing could be further from the truth. It's just that uplines want to be absolved from any responsibility so they teach downline that failure in Amway is their own (The downline's) fault. Upline is also quick to take credit for any success, of course. Why shouldn't these same leaders be held accountable for their downline's results?

The reason why hard work doesn't equal success is because an Amway IBO is basically a commissioned sales person. In commissioned sales, one can work hard for no reward and at times, little effort may reap large rewards. But in Amway, with a spotty reputation, Amway IBOs are dealt a handicap that most simply cannot overcome. Getting new people to recruitment meetings is hard enough, not even factoring in the abililty to sponsor others. When factoring in these tidbits, it's easy to see why uplines teach buy from yourself and selling is not needed.

The work involved is very simple. Sell products and get other IBOs in your downline to be able to leverage your volume. Many IBOs work hard and attend all of the functions and do all of the steps as outlined by upline, but very few reap rewards and most quit when they realize that the system doesn't work. It is sad that on top of losing money, that IBOs are also taught to blame themselves for their demise. Where is the upline when IBOs bust their butts working har and get no rewards? On top of that, to make it worse, uplines profit from selling training and motivation to their downlines. Why aren't they held acountable?

I've read comments by some Amway defenders wanting to sue Amway critics for a potential loss of business. But most critics, like myself are simply stating our experiences and opinions. Many of which are true and still happening today. So I will ask, what about the millions of former IBOs who may have lost billions of dollars because of false claims which led them to believe that they would get rich following upline advice? Maybe former IBOs should unite and file claims against unethical upline leaders who led them astray? Why not hold these leaders accountable?

In any case, hard work doesn't equate success in Amway and I dare anyone to try to prove me wrong.

Wednesday, November 7, 2012

Is Amway A Viable Business Opportunity?

Over the years I have been debating with Amway supporters, I cannot see what is so great about the Amway opportunity. Are some of these Amway defenders that stupid or dense that they truly believe that a business where one out of a few hundred people might make a profit and most of the remaining IBOs will lose money is a good opportunity? I'm not talking about people who sign up and "do nothing". Many IBOs sign up and put in a great deal of time, effort and money, only to find out that the system simply does not work (especially in the US) and they make a business decision to quit and/or to do something else.

Of course there are some people who make money in Amway. If nobody made money, then the opportunity would cease to exist. But it is basically exploitation of the downline that accounts for upline success. Amway's admission that sales to non IBOs are low, confirms this. Thus certain upline make their income from their downline's PV volume, and on tool purchases. I mean even a lottery has winners. Even ponzi schemes and other questionable opportunties have some winners. This is not to suggest that Amway in not legal. Amway is perfectly legal, but the way the opportunity is set up, those who profit, primarily do so at the expense of their trusted downline.

There are no groups that I know of where all the IBOs can win and earn a profit. I would guess that there might be a few rogue groups who only focus on retail sales, and while these groups can be profitable as a group, they are few and far between. This is because most IBOs fall under an LOS such as WWDB, BWW, LTD or N21, and these groups all seemingly focus on recruiting of new IBOs. Yes, they may sprinkle in some suggeestions about selling goods, but generally speaking, their "training" materials consist of motivation speeches, feel good stories (whether true or not), and the theme of never quitting while continuing to purchase more tools.

Some upline have the nerve to start teaching downline that their Amway business is not about making money, but to save your marriage, make you a nicer person, or some other diversion to make you forget that you are losing money month after month after month. Some groups even mix in religion and politics into their functions and meetings. As far as I can see, the typical business buildiing IBO signs up, gets some of the tools and attends a few functions, and finds that the products are hard to sell because they are not priced competetively with other retailers, and that a damaged reputation is nearly impossible to overcome. These IBOs realize they are not going anywhere, and they walk away, chalking up the losses as a life lesson. But apparently, many uplines who lied and deceived in the past are continuing to do so today, often just revising history for their benefit (i.e. lying about making any profit on tools).

Many IBOs, prospects, information seekers and critics read this blog. My question is very simple. What is so great about the Amway opportunity? For most, it is just a bad use of time and money. While some may exist, I don't know of a single person who "did the work once" and sat back collecting barrels of Amway money while sipping Mai Tais on the beaches of Jamaica. I see crown ambassadors working as hard today as they did many years ago. Diamonds losing homes to forclosures, a prominent diamond in bankruptcy proceedings, and a hoard of WWDB diamonds apparently selling off mansions that they allegedly paid for in cash. (It os quite possible that their lifestyles are simply not sustainable).

Where is the benefit in the business for the typical IBO? Just as there are some diamonds, there are lottery winners. Displaying a lottery winner doesn't make it prudent to spend your money on lottery tickets. Displaying a diamond's lifestyle doesn't make Amway a good opportunity. While Amway is a business and not a game of chance, the results of either, sadly are eerily similar - that is a few winners and millions of non winners.

What is so great about the Amway opportunity? I don't see it.

Monday, November 5, 2012

The Amway Illusion?

One of the things my upline taught us ad nauseum was that we needed to have faith in our business and in our upline. That we needed to believe that we were going to be successful. IBOs are told that they should act successful even if they are still working their way up the ranks in the business. It is why they ask (require) IBOs to wear suits and business attire to all meetings and functions. This is one of the weird quirks about the business in my opinion. I live in Hawaii and I remember a function they held in the middle of July in a high school auditorium and there was no air conditioning. I think my suit needed special cleaning because it was completely saturated with persiration.

Anyway, with this part of the year, soon there will be thousands of IBOs shuffling off to a function called dream night, or in some cases, winter conference. The tickets are about $60 to $80 and includes a dinner. What IBOs are often unaware of is that many venues will allow you to run these conferences for $20 to $25 per person. The rest of that ticket prices goes directly into your upline's pockets. Anyway, the dream night function will feature slide shows of mansions, yachts, jet skis, sports cars, fabulous vacations and other trappings of wealth.

What many IBOs don't realize is that this display of wealth is just that. There is no bonafide evidence to indicate that these diamonds actually own all of those toys and goodies. The diamonds probably won't verbally confirm it either, because these toys and goodies may not really be owned by them. It could be rented, or maybe some upline corwn ambassador may own the mansion, but IBOs will assume that these trappings of wealth are common once you reach diamond. As an IBO, I never actually knew how much a diamond really earned. I just assumed it was a lot because we were shown all of these goodies and just assumed all diamonds had these kinds of lifestyles.

If I posted a picture of a mansion and a jet and said I owe it all to my earnings as a blogger, people would cry foul, that I am lying or making things up. And they would be right. Well, I would guess that many diamonds are doing the very same thing if they appear on stage and implying that they have jets and mansions. As I said, someone may own a mansion and a jet, but to imply that this is a part of the typical diamond lifestyle is a stretch. The evidence is there. Some diamonds have lost their homes to foreclosure. My old LOS diamonds (WWDB) taught us that diamonds pay cash for everything, including homes. Now confirmed as a blatant lie. Who knows what else they may have misrepresented?

I ask IBOs and prospects who may be attending dream night, to watch with a critical eye. What is being implied with the display of wealth? Analyze if those goodies can be purchased with a diamond income ($150,000 plus some tool income). Ask yourself if this lifestyle is truly sustainable? Ask yourself if you can live with yourself if deception is a part of earning your diamond lifestyle?

Thursday, November 1, 2012

Getting Out Of Or Getting Deeper Into Debt?

One of the things that many uplines will talk about with their downline is debt. Many IBOs and prospects join Amway, hoping that Amway will help them eliminate debt, by providing some extra income. What many IBOs find out though, is that they end up more deeply in debt, not because of Amway necessarily, but often because of the pressure to purchase tools and function tickets. While getting out of debt is a good idea, the same upline may advise that person to go deeper in hock to participate in Amway.

Eliminating debt on the surface, is a good thing. However, I believe that many uplines only want IBOs to eliminate debt so they can free up discretionary monies that can be channeled into tool purchases, which uplines profit from. So while the advice seems sound, it still ends up as a self serving piece of advice. If you are an IBO or a prospect, is your upline advising you to eliminate debt and then turning around and telling you to attend "all" functions?

As a WWDB IBO, I heard the mantra about getting rid of debt. It sounded good to me, but I was floored when the same upline told us it was okay to go deeper in hock if it was to further our business, or in other words, to buy more standing orders or to attend functions. I could not understand why it was okay to create more debt, but only to "invest" in your business. If debt is bad, then functions and other tools should be cut as well, until the IBO can reasonably afford to participate in the system. IBOs, in my opinion. should be using profits from the business in order to purchase tools. If there is no net profit, then that IBO needs to decide whether or not the tools are worthy of an investment. Even if an IBO has some profits, the IBOs should determine whether to bank the profit or to channel them towards tool purchases.

Too many IBOs trust their upline and make initial and ongoing purchases of tools, and then continue to do so without seeing tangible results. I believe this is why IBOs are taught to trust and have faith. Or that success is right around the corner. It keeps an IBO going, even in the absence of results. Hopefully a post like this can bring awareness to IBOs and potential IBOs. Good luck to those who disregard this information.

Wednesday, October 31, 2012

Is Your Amway Upline Your "Coach"?

In the Amway business, many active IBOs are advised to trust upline. To think of upline as a coach or a mentor. These upline mentors or coaches are supposed to have your best interest at heart and they will guide you to success if only you will be open to learning. Many uplines, including my former uplines used to coin the term "copy" or duplicate. If you can do that you will be successful. Even the simplest of people can copy. The upline may crack a joke about getting thru school by copying. Thus, many IBOs follow exactly what their upline advises them to do.

But then uplines turn the responsibility away from themselves. Many Amway defenders will also claim that downline should not simply follow the advice of upline. They may make a ridiculous claim that standing orders and functions contain advice that must be discerned. That information is like a buffet. You pick and choose what you need and discard the rest. If you are a new IBO or prospect, let me tell you that is a load of guano (crap) that is being heaped on you. Your upline is touted as having experience and wisdom in the Amway business, which is why you are paying good money for voicemail, books, cds, and functions. So why would their advice be something you pick and choose? How would a new IBO know what to pick and choose?

Imagine hiring a guide for a trek in the wilderness. The guide is supposed to be an experienced outdoorsman, perhaps an expert. So if he recommends that you eat certain plants or fruits, you trust that he is going to guide you right. Imagine eating something that made you sick to your stomach, only to have the guide tell you that he just points out plants and fruits and you have to discern which is good for you and which is not. You would fire the guide and tell everyone you know not to use that guide anymore.

But here we have these "systems" such as Network 21, WWDB or BWW that have been "guiding" IBOs for up to 20 years or more in some cases, and the number of diamonds are negligible. Sure there are many new platinums, but many tool consuming platinums have been found to be losing money or making very little money for their efforts. What's more, it would appear that Amway is losing ground in North America based on sales. One can reasonably guess that any new platinums that break are simply replacing the volume for a platinum that no longer exists or a platinum that no longer qualifies. My former upline diamond appears to have all new qualifying platinums from the time I was in the business and here's the kicker. My former diamond had 6 downline rubies. As far as I know, none of these rubies are qualified as platinum anymore, although I have heard that some of these are still active.

Uplines also program their downline to take responsibility for the failure. Thus you have IBOs who did everything that was asked of them, only to fail. Yet these IBOs often blame themselves for their failure. It is my opinion that former IBOs who did everything asked of them only to fail should file a formal complaint against their LOS with the better business bureau. Amway defenders like to think that a lack of formal complaints means that the system works when clearly, there is no unbiased substantial evidence to suggest that the system works. It looks like some succeed in spite of the system, not because of.

The catch in all this is uplines skirting responsibility for the outcomes of those they "mentor" and profit from. IBOs should ask if upline really cared about their success, why do you have to pay for any help that you receive from your upline diamond?

Monday, October 29, 2012

Amway IBOs Reap What They Sow?

One of the things that many prospects and IBOs believe is that they will make an investment of time and money into Amway and that they will eventually get their time and money back in such abundance that they can walk off their jobs, and walk the beaches of the world while living on lifelong residual income, all because of the Amway opportunity. For IBOs and prospects of Amway, I wonder if any of you can actually name even five people who have actually accomplished this? Keep in mind that there have probably been tens of millions of people who also wanted this and tried Amway and the systems, only to find that reality paints a different picture.

Many people they will reap what they sow. While that many sound true, I guess the next logical question is what are you sowing? Are you deceptive when prospecting people to see the plan? Are you having to justify and hide price comparisons that are not favorable? Are you actually selling goods to customers and actually qualifying for your Amway bonus? Do you have a negative opinion (broke losers) about people who don't join Amway or are not interested in seeing the plan? Do you now think your boss and your job are evil? Do you leave your kids at home to attend endless numbers of functions and meetings? You reap what you sow correct?

I wonder what some WWDB diamonds were sowing? At least the ones who had their homes foreclosed, and one in particular was involved in chapter 7 bankruptcy proceedings? Are they reaping what they sowed? What about the WWDB diamonds who got divorced? What were they sowing? Are IBO sure about wanting to make the claim of reaping and sowing? And yes, Joecool the person also has his own flaws, but the difference is that I am not on stage proclaiming to be flawless and many diamonds would imply when they speak (and profit from) their tens of thousands of downlines. I am not earning a living by deceiving people and profiting from people I am supposed to be helping.

Are you reaping what you sow?

Thursday, October 25, 2012

Is Your Upline A Mentor Or A Lousy Consultant?

The really insidious part about some of the LOS leaders, such as the ones I had in WWDB, is that they apparently are cutthroat ruthless businessmen with nice suits, and disguised as your mentors and friends. They get you to trust them, and they will tell you that they have your best interest at heart, or that they would never purposely lead you astray. On the surface, you may think this is true, but look at their actions and you can easily discern that some of these uplines are absolutely ruthless businessmen who would take every cent from you if they could. I was in WWDB and I have good reasons to believe that they are still doing this, based on a WWDB IBO blog. On this blog, I see all the same teachings today, that I heard as an IBO and some of the same claims such as buying homes in cash. It's scary.

As an IBO, the diamonds would tell you to never miss a function, ever. The only good reason for missing a function was for your own funeral. I recall some crossline IBOs rearranging pre-planned anniverssary parties, weddings, and other special family events in the name of being core and attending all functions. Some IBOs actually did quit their jobs to attend functions and they very well may have done so because some uplines taught this. IBOs were also encouraged and told to go into debt to attend a function. This was okay because it was an investment into your business.

Our group was also strongly encouraged to buy extra cds every week. To be core, you needed to listen to a cd each day and you cannot listen to the same one each day right? Couples were told to buy their own seperate standing orders. Brad Duncen even had a true north tape (cd) that said sponsors were to eat the standing orders for downlines who quit because it was too much trouble to call upline who calls upline who calls upline to cancel a standing order. Oddly enough, they didn't mind upline calling upline calling upline to add a standing order.

In the end, I was lucky enough to have been progressing up the pin ranks so my losses were not that devastating. I ended up losing in my early months of the business but mostly broke even when I was at 4000 PV. Sadly though, my crossline did not fare so well. I know of one couple who declared bankruptcy. I don't know how much their WWDB involvement contributed to bankruptcy, but I am certain it was a major factor and I know of two couples who had homes foreclosed, and I believe that their allegiance to WWDB was a factor in those foreclosures. But I guess hey, two WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed so maybe they were duplicating?

Do not be fooled. The diamonds may have a nice smile and a nice suit, but they are ruthless businessmen who will take your last dime if you allow them to.

Wednesday, October 24, 2012

Amway Makes You "Rich"?

Amway can make you rich. Many IBOs say they were told that Amway was not "get rich quick". But obviously, someone must have given them the impression that Amway would eventually make them rich, otherwise, why would anyone join? Why would anyone want to work that hard and embarrass themselves in front to friends and family to promote a business that will more likely get you funny looks than money. But can Amway actually make you rich?

Well, yeah, Amway can make you rich if you are a diamond selling voicemail services, books, standing orders and function tickets. Amway can make you rich if you own Amway and sell to millions of IBOs who "buy from themselves". Amway can make you rich if you write a book that millions of IBOs purchase. Amway can make you rich if you can get enough loyal downline to keep purchasing products so that you can get the bonuses. But aside from these few people who I just described, the Amway opportunity is more likely to make you broke, or at least lighter in the pockets.

Most IBOs do not even earn enough to cover their monthly voicemail expenditures, much less the other support materials that are pushed on the downline in groups such as WWDB or BWW, or N21. These materials are touted as the "key to success" in Amway when in reality, it is the key to success for the uplines who share in the profits from these materials. The real kicker is despite claims that these materials are key to success, the uplines get their followers to blame themselves if the system doesn't work for them. Kind of like tossing a coin and saying "heads I win, tails you lose". Upline wins as long as you buy support materials from them, and your results are of no consequence to them. In fact they probably don't want new diamonds as they would then have to share the tool money.

So can Amway make you rich? I would guess it is possible, but it is also possible for you to win the powerball lottery. It takes normally, over 100 downline IBOs to create a platinumship. And a platinumship occurs less than once in 200 IBOs. And at that level, you likely make little profit or break even. That tells me a whole lot. What does it tell you?

Friday, October 19, 2012

Amway Complaints?

Over the years, I have seen literally hundreds (if not more) blogs and testimonials about Amway. Most of them decry the pitfalls of being an Amway IBO. Most of the complaints cite the fact that Amway in general has higher prices than comparable retailers and the fact that the system consisting of voicemail, books, cds and seminars ate up any profits the IBO may have made and resulted in net losses for most. One particular Amway apologist bemoans the fact that the internet is full of bad testomonials about Amway. The reason why there are so many negative testimonials about Amway is because over the years, thousands, possibly millions either had a bad experience for the reasons I cited above, or personally know of someone who had a bad experience.

Amway defenders will often cite the fact that many IBOs sign up and "do nothing" as their defense to this. But I will easily point out that I haven't seen anyone say they signed up, failed to do anything or order products, quit and started blogging about a bad experience in Amway. These defenders will also compare Amway to the gym where people sign up and "do nothing". Whether true or not, I also do not see people who sign up and "do nothing" complain about not receiving health benefits by simply signing up. It is a very weak defense. Conversely, I have seen numerous accounts of folks like myself who did put in effort, some for many years, who did what upline advised and did not see the financial rewards that is promoted in "the plan".

Amway defenders will then try to justify themselves, saying that the better business bureau (BBB) receives few formal complaints about Amway. I will agree with this. Many IBOs never bother to file formal complaints to the BBB or to Amway because in many, probably most cases, the person who quits and may have had a bad experience, was sponsored into the business. The sponsor was often a friend or family member of the IBO who left the business. Many will simply leave and forget the episode and chalk it up to a learning experience in life. Some will complain, but really have to ne venue to voice their remorse about joining. Some of us have found the interent to be quite effective in sharing our experiences and our opinions on why the business did not work. This is what one Amway defender calls the "internet war". What I have pointed out is that critics most often simply point out what the IBOs themselves have done. In many cases, the IBO is his own worst enemy. Afterall, critics didn't deny Amway and Quixtar had a connection, nor did critics make up claims about perfect water, etc.

It would appear that most of the problems has a root in the AMO systems, such as WWDB, BWW, LTD, or N21. Now, not all upline leaders are unethical, but it appears that many are, and new IBOs have no way to identify the good from the bad. It also appears that some of these upline leaders will issue bad avice. Advice that is detrimental to the IBOs, but financially beneficial to themselves, such as telling IBOs to never miss a function, or to buy more cds. In many cases, these unethical uplines do not care about IBO success, their goal is just to move as many support materials as possible, so they can fund their "diamond" lifestyle. Sadly, it is also apparent that the diamond lifestyle may be a facade in some cases. An illusion of wealth portrayed as a recruiting tool.

If you recognize some of these warning signs, ask tough questions of your potential sponsor and visit this or some of the blogs linked to this one for more information.

Wednesday, October 17, 2012

Why Most Amway IBOs Can't Build A Business?

Building an Amway business. That's what many IBOs set out to do, except they don't know how to build a business, and based on IBO behavior and the things they say and do, it makes me wonder what their upline actually knows about building a business. A typical business owner will get started, and needs people to know that their business is there.

When you open a store or a restaurant, you may not make a lot of money intitially because not enough customers know about your store and you have not yet built a reputation. New customers who have a good experience are likely to return for more, and they are also likely to tell others about your store. Over time, you create a customer base and your weekly sales become consistent and somewhat predictable. Conversely, if customers have a bad experience, they are likely to tell others as well.

In the Amway business, many IBOs have no idea about building a business. They are shown great (apparent) wealth by upline, and then told that their business activity consists of showing the plan, listening to standing order and attending functions. Most of an IBO's activity, as prescribed by upline, costs money instead of generating sales. Some uplines do teach IBOs to sell items, but more often than not, it is not taught as a priority.

What's more, as I said, a new business will get repeat customers when a customer has a good experience. What do you suppose happens when IBOs lie or trick people into attending Amway meetings, or deceive people about their business, or make up wild stories about perfect water? What happens when you embellish the truth about success and then cannot provide an answer when a recruit asks and IBO how they are doing in the Amway business? What happens when an IBO tells a potential recruit that he or she is a loser or stupid for not joining Amway? Would you return to a store if they called you stupid as you were leaving? What if you were called a loser?

These are the reasons why IBOs in general cannot get enough customers to sustain a consistent and predictable amount of sales, and why over the years, Amway has at best a spotty reputation. Just the mention of the name Amway and you may get funny looks from people. It is why certain internet zealots promoting Amway do more harm than good.

Tuesday, October 16, 2012

Amway IBOs And Personal Responsibility?

One of the disturbing things I have noticed about Amway IBOs and IBO leaders is how they wlll tell downline to trust them. To trust them as they have already blazed a trail. No need to re-invent the wheel. Just ride the coattails of your upline to success. The system is proven. Many IBOs take this to heart and put forth tremendous effort. Then when they fail, upline will shun them and tell them that the failure is their own. That they are personally responsible for failure. Where's the responsibility of the upline? Why aren't they held accountable for the people who trusted them and followed their advice?

Now I am not talking about IBOs who sign up and do nothing, or never place an order. I do believe that the fact that many IBOs sign up and do nothing brings concerns about how these IBOs were recruited, but I did not recall ever seeing an IBO do nothing and then complain that Amway was a scam or anything like that. Most of these IBOs will fade away and never be heard from again.

I have found, however, that many people who are critical of Amway and the systems, put forth much effort, did everything they were told, and did not find the success that upline promoted, or in some cases, guaranteed. My former sponsor was still active, last I heard and has been in Amway for over 18 years. I do not believe he has ever gone beyond platinum, and I know that he was never a Q12 platinum. Some Amway apologists might see being a platinum as a bonus, but when you are hard core sold out to the systems, platinum is a break even or make a small profit business. Factor in that time spent by husband and wife and these folks are breaking even or making a fraction of minumum wage. Is this the dream that will allow you to buy mansions with a cash payment? There are likely many instances where platinums fully sold out to the systems still end up losing money as the support materials and functions can add up quickly.

What is also disturbing is how people will tout the system as responsible for any success, but hide the vast majority that the system doesn't help. Sure, some will succeed in Amway, but for every success, there are hundreds if not thousands who fail. And if you consider diamond as the benchmark of success, the failures could be in the millions. As I said, some succeed, but very very few in relation to the number who try. Going diamond is probably less common in the US than winning the lottery. Amway is a business opportunity, but the overall results for success are similar to a lottery. What does that tell you?

Succeed and the systems and upline take credit, but fail or quit and it is your own responsibility. Are these the kinds of leaders or mentors you want advice from?
I will pass.