Are You Still CORE?

Here is a breakdodown of CORE and why it doesn’t work. Here are the CORE steps. Some groups may have variations of CORE, but this is generally what many groups use. CORE is allegedly the proven system of success. Apologists claims that people who are CORE for at least six months straight will succeed. I doubt it. There are many examples, including my former sponsor who can suggest it doesn't work.

1 - Show the Plan (10-15 per month)
2 - Retail the Products (10 customers @10 PV each)
3 – Tapes/cds
4 - Books
5- Functions (attend all)
6 - Accountability
7 - Counsel with Upline (Be teachable!)
8 - Buy 100% of your own products
9 – Communikate

Many upline will tell you that your success is nearly 100% guaranteed if you follow these steps for 2-5 years. Some Amway enthusiasts will tell you that 6 months of this activity will nearly assure you of a platinum level business. Certain steps are within the IBO’s control, such as reading every day and listening to cds, and attending functions. It is also easy enough to be accountable, counsel with upline, buy your own products, and use KATE (voicemail).

Here’s where an IBO’s efforts will break down. Showing the plan and retailing products. And remember, if you cannot do these steps then you are not considered “CORE” and your upline will likely tell you that it is your own fault and that you simply haven’t been CORE, therefore you did not achieve success. There is some truth in this but let me expose the system in a different angle.

Amway has a spotty reputation in the US. I don’t think anyone can dispute this fact. Therefore, for the vast majority of people, being able to show the plan 10-15 times per month is a nearly impossible task. If you are able to do this, you are a really good salesman or a good liar. In this scenario, the IBO is already successful, but not because of CORE, but simply because the IBO has the gift of being able to convince people into seeing the plan. But for many IBOs, they may contact hundreds of people and not be able to get anyone to see the plan. Even IBOs who follow upline advice on how to contact will probably not be able to show 10-15 plans per month. Thus this IBO, who is doing the work, will not be able to succeed. The system will blame the IBO, but the reality is that the IBO has too big of a disadvantage to overcome.

Secondly, with high prices (on average) and with a spotty reputation, most IBOs are unable to retail products. Amway itself has admitted that less than 4% of Amway products are sold to customers (non IBOs). Thus most IBOs are unable to sell products, therefore they are not CORE, therefore upline will blame the IBO for failure..

What if an IBO contacts 1000 people and cannot get 10 people to see the plan? Upline will claim that IBO is not CORE and therefore it is personal failure of the IBO. IMO, the only reason why upline can claim that CORE works is because in order to do the CORE steps consistently, you have to already be at a certain level of success. The vast majority of IBOs cannot and will never be able to reach that level.

That is the myth and the deception that many uplines will use to attract recruits. That each IBO can do the CORE steps. When only a fraction of 1% ever reach the level of platinum or higher, the numbers strongly support what is written here. Apologists are welcome to try and prove me wrong, but they can't.

Amway & Costco

A Re-Post of this blog's most popular thread. I made some comments in bold:

Funny Story, the other day at work, I get a call from a friend, asking me to deliver a package for him to a mutual friend. A catalog drops out of the bag. It’s an Amway catalog, and apparently a friend of mine still buys dish drops. Anyway, I look at a few popular items from the catalog and compare them to Costco prices. I am shocked. Just by purchasing Gatorade at Costco instead of quixtar, I already get $14 savings and 80 ounces more product!


Prices Competetive?

XS Sports drinks 24 16 oz bottles = $30.00
Gatorade 24 20oz bottles = $15.95 (at Costco)

XS energy drinks 8.4 oz (case of 12) = $23.99
Red Bull 8 oz (case of 24) $31.30 (at Costco)

Double X (31 day supply) $78.05
Multi Vitamins (3 month supply) $24.80 (At Costco)

SA8 6.6 pound (100 loads) $22.75
Kirkland (5 gallon bucket from Costco) $15.99

Meadowbrook bath tissue 48 rolls $29.99
Kirkland bath tissue 36 rolls $11.99 (Costco)
Some Amway zealots actually had the gall to debate the quality of toilet paper

Smart menu Pasta 12 – 16 oz. Bags = $24.99
Golden Grain Pasta 12 16oz. Boxes = $8.99 (Costco)

Smart menu chunk light tuna 24 6 oz cans $25.99
Coral chunk light tuna 12 6 oz. cans $5.99 (Costco)

Progresso soups 8 19 oz cans $19.99
Progresso soups 8 19 oz cans $11.99 (Costco)
This soup at Costco was exactly the same 8 pack as the one in the Amway catalog

Amway And Pyramids?

Let me start out by saying that Amway is a perfectly legal company. Therefore I am not saying or implying that Amway is illegal. But I believe that the way Amway businesses are run, are like pyramids. In most groups, you will have the lowest level IBOs efforts and tool purchases being responsible for the upline bonuses and tools income. Many many IBOs are fooled into thinking that the ability to surpass your upline or that you don't get paid to recruit downline makes this a good deal. Think about it for a bit. Aren't most Amway gatherings about motivation and recruiting?

Unless you have a very very rare group where actual product sales to non IBOs is sufficient to cover the costs of running your business, functions and all, then it is true that the lower level IBO's jobs are likely the source of income for the uplines. How many groups are like that? None that I have ever seen or know of. In fact, how often do IBOs even sell enough products to cover their expenses for even one month out of the year? The groups that teach "buy from yourself" end up doing the most financial damage to their groups because the downline's expenses are then covered exclusively from the downlines jobs, bank accounts, or drive the downline into debt.

I've seen and discussed group structures in forums many times and I can only conclude that tool sales wipe out what little profits/bonuses some of the downlines might receive. Only when an IBO is able to sponsor enough downline to absorb the losses for them will they finally breal even or make a little profit. I would guess that the 4000 PV level or platinum is where a dedicated CORE IBO would breal even and possibly start to make a real profit. But we also know that most platinum groups have 100 or more IBOs in order to generate 7500 PV. Thus we can also conclude that less than 1% of IBOs make a net profit. The only way IBOs can earn a net profit at a lower level is to avoid purchasing tools and to avoid paying for functions. Those who get involved in a system such as WWDB or N21 almost guarantee that they will have a net loss.

Sure, my job may have a pyramid structure with the CEO making the most money. But the difference is that in a company, even the lowest paid employee still receives a paycheck and has money at the end of the month. The same claim cannot be made by IBOs. For these reasons, I believe Amway to be a legal pyramid. IBOs and information seekers are free to participate, but I challenge them to sit down and really analyze their ability to make a net profit. In most cases, the analysis won't be favorable. If you are in the US in particular, you may have great difficulty in even being able to discuss "Amway" without getting strange looks your way from others. Good luck in whatever you decide

The "Truth" About Amway?

Comment left on Happy Franchisee blog:

http://www.unhappyfranchisee.com/will-amway-make-you-annoying/

mary on December 5th, 2011 10:35 am

My husband and I were involved in the Amway/Quixtar business for 13 years. We worked very hard, attended all the meetings, reached the direct level, and made very little money. Thank God for Dateline. We were convinced that this was a reputable business,the people were great….so we thought. Then we found out the truth. The majority of the money that was told to us was suppose to be on the products and sponsoring /helping others,l was actually made on the books,tapes and seminars. You know they tell you that the speakers take the time from their families to give back to the business. Totally false ! The speakers are paid to perform. That is how they make money. Please believe me when I say that you are not being stupid just convinced by people you trust that you will make money. We went to our sponsors and told them we know how they are making money. We watched Dateline , years ago and still could not believe how we were tricked. It is sad that people will continue to believe this opportunity will produce millionaires. Most of the people in our upline were sued by other people and eventually went on to another scam. I know you will find this hard to believe. I did too. I am now reading all this information and at one time felt the same way. Again you are not stupid… just misinformed. We worked long hours, left our children with sitters, argued with our family , and listened to our upline to not believe the internet. If you make money at this business it will be on the books, tapes, seminars and speaking. We could not comprehend how our upline could have lied to us… they were good people that also got caught up in the lies. It is really difficult to listen to someone speak highly of this business, I know I would defend the products and the system too. I also thought I knew what was going on but I did not know the truth. Find another way to make money you, will be glad you found out now.

Profit Is The Motivation That IBOs Need?

I believe that Amway IBOs have approximately a 50% attrition rate for the first year alone. If you look at a 5 year window, I believe the attrition rate is something like 95%. So what we're saying is that out of 100 IBOs, only 5 will be around in 5 years, or out of 1000 IBOs, 50 will remain after 5 years. This is extremely significant because if you are a business builder, you will need to replace half of your IBOs every single year. For this reason, I am very doubtful that there are IBOs who "built the business right and built it once", who no longer do Amway related work, but still collect significant residual income. I would guess that significant income could be defined as being enough to live a lifestyle in the top tax bracket (for the US) without having to report to a J-O-B.

Now I understand that some IBOs take it personally when I bring up subjects like this. It is because they have been deceived by some upline diamond or big pin who has sold them on a dream of financial prosperity for life if they will only work hard for 2-5 years. I once thought so too, but realized that there isn't a single diamond that I know of who built the business right and walked away to enjoy the beaches of the world while truckloads of money rolls in. Kinda makes you wonder why you see Crowns still working, and diamonds actually quitting or resigning. I have asked the question many times and it has never been answered. Can anyone name a few people who built their business right and built it once who is currently enjoying these lifelong residuals? Also, if that were a benefit, why doesn't Amway say so?

Instead, you have a constant and endless flow of motivation being sold to IBOs. This motivation comes in the form of cds, books, meetings, functions and other things like voicemail messages. It's sad that IBOs have to continue to pay through the nose for motivation and "teaching" about the Amway business when there are cheaper and more efficient means of communication. For example, why would you need an expensive voicemail when a facebook group account can disseminate messages to your group in seconds at no cost? It is because the uplines want to extract every possible sent from their downline. Because of the internet, I believe people are starting to figure things out and avoid the systems altogether. I hope Joecool's blog contributes to this.

All the motivation IBOs truly need is to see a net profit at the end of the month. If IBOs actually earned an extra $200 a month, or $50 a month, or $600 a month as advertised, there would be no need for motivational speeches. The IBOs would simply look at the growth in their finances and they would keep going. The poor retention rate is easy to explain. IBOs are losing money because of the system expenses and they lose their motivation to continue. If you are an IBO or a prospect, stop and think for a minute. If you are making an extra $200 a month with minimal effort, would you need functions and other materials to motivate you? Or would you have intrinsic motivation from the profit? All the motivation you will ever need is a net profit. Take that to the bank.

Amway And WWDB & Integrity?

I've been following the blog of a WWDB IBO named "Shaun". He runs the blog called "Expeditions Of Truth" http://expeditionoftruths.com/

He seems to think that not only is he in business with people full of integrity, he also thinks that he is going to retire in November 2011. Is this now December 2011? While I think doing business with people of integrity is a good thing, I also know of many successful people in business who are ruthless. So are Amway and in particular, WWDB people full of integrty or are they just as ruthless as other business people? Does it matter? In my opinion, it doesn't matter except for the fact that WWDB people seem to think that they have integrity filled leaders.

Well, lets look at some of these leaders. Back in the 1990's, the current batch of WWDB leaders swore that nobody made a profit on tools. Nobody knew the truth at the time. We now know that this was a lie. Is this integrity? We know that Greg Duncan was in chapter 7 bankruptcy proceedings. Not paying for your obligations is integrity? We know that Greg Duncan and David Shores had homes foreclosed (Public information). Is that a move filled with integrity? With the tons of money Duncan and Shores make, couldn't they have made an effort to pay off their debts?
If you look at a blog linked to this one "Rocket's Rants", there's a youtube video of "crown" Brad Duncan telling rank and file IBOs that they can make "hundreds of thousands of dollars" a month. First of all, I wonder if Brad Duncan has achieved this himself, let alone any others? Even if someone had achieved it, it would be illegal or unethical to portray that kind of success as achieveable to a a prospect.

Brad Wolgamott used to talk about how WWDB had a low divorce rate. Is it full on integrity for WWDB leaders to seperate or divorce when they talk about integrity and how Amway and WWDB saves marriages? What about Dean Kosage? Another divorcee? Are they full of integrity? What say you Shaun Guthrie of WWDB? What about Howie Danzik whose website doesn't mention that he was once married to Susan? Is it integrity to say you built the business as a single when Howie previously built the business with his former wife?

Amway's owner Rich DeVos ackowledged that the "tools" were likely a pyramid scam and Amway did nothing after sales dropped following some attempts to clean it up. Is that an integrity move? I don't know but
it sure seems as if WWDB and Amway have issues where integrity is concerned.

Edification and Amway?

Edification. During my time in the Amway business, we saw many IBOs get edified, including myself. Of course it felt great when your upline platinum or diamond would say something that made you stand out in the crowd. For example, I remember an IBO being exalted because he quit his job to attend a major function. His boss wouldn't allow him to use vacation time so he quit to attend the function. I remember Brad Wolgamott telling people it's just a job, attend the function and get another one (job). I remember at a family reunion function, a man was edified by the diamonds because he was diagnosed with terminal cancer but instead of being at home and bitching and moaning, there he was at an Amway function, making a difference in the world they would say. But looking back, I truly believe that the upline's intentions were to uplift those who went thru extraordinary efforts to spend money on tools or functions.

In other words, you are buying your edification. Of course when I say you are buying your edification, you are not necessarily doing so in dollars. It can either be in dollars or in time. For example, you may have been edified for listening to 15 standing orders in one day, or you may be edified for driving the miles to show plans, even if the guest was a no-show. I also recall some IBOs in the group being edified for 1000 PV personal use in a month. I honestly don't know who anyone can possibly do 1000 PV in personal use without the purchase of some big ticket items. I mean how much SA8 or LOC can anyone use in the month? I suppose that you could make Nutrilite vitamins your main source of food or something like that and move a lot of PV, but it's ridiculous to spend that much on personal use.

So to what extent are you willing to go to get ediified? For my upline sponsor, it was what he lived for. My sponsor was/is a physician and he therefore could have a nice lifestyle without Amway but he was more interested in the recognition and edification. He ate it up when he was asked to speak at a function once. He told the group in a nite owl that the dream of being on stage as a diamond was more important to him than the money. Sadly, he never got beyond the platinum level as far as I know and last I heard, he was below 4000 PV. Whatever your dream or reason for building Amway, I honestly believe you need to look at the cost of it. For example, you wouldn't sell your soul to the devil in order to go diamond. I actually wonder how my former sponsor feels these days now that our upline diamond (his hero) has moved to Washington and he cannot spend much time with him anymore?

The cost of edification in Amway is high. Are you willing to foot that bill? I'm glad I woke up and decided that there are much better ways to spend my time, money and efforts. Joecool's blog is one of the better things. :-)