Tuesday, February 7, 2012

Amway IBOs Can't Handle "The Truth"?

Joecool's blog has recently been frequented by an IBO from Texas. This IBO runs his own pro Amway blog. Good for him! What I find odd is that so many IBOs like to cultivate the comments on their blog. In other words, if you aren't wearing rose colored glasses and making postive comments, then they won't publish your comments. Another current WWDB IBO who runs his Expeditions of Truth blog, also won't publish comments.

Conversely, this blog allows both pro and cons. Free discussion is welcome and I even allow insults and jabs. Afterall, it's just a debate over a controversial company and frankly, the controversy and spotty reputation is well earned. There are countless stories of people mislead or straight out lied to about an "opportunity", or IBOs hiding the fact that they are being invited to an Amway meeting. There are still IBO leaders who use pictures of mansions or sports cars as proof that Amway works and that the same can be accomplished with 2-5 years of work. Or that you build it once and you can walk away with wealth beyond your dreams. In many cases, these are outright lies and in some cases, the diamonds on stage are actually in debt or having financial difficulty themselves. There's plenty of evidence on the internet,

So why do IBOs want to hide the truth? Is it because the truth isn't very flattering? Is the actual truth a net loss in the Amway business? Is it true that you are spending more on tools than you are generating in sales? Are you actually selling products to customers (non IBOs) are are you buying the 100 PV mostly by yourself? Are you promoting vitamins making claims without knowing anything about nutrition? These are some of the behaviors I have observed in some IBOs. Some of these behaviors are dishonest and unethical. Some IBOs have gone so far as to leave veiled threats on this blog as well. But IBOs still insist that they are "all good".

The truth is that the plan shown to many prospects reveals the reality. in a 6-4-2 or whatever version of the plan, there's only about 1 in 100 who reaches the platinum level. Factoring in that many IBOs quit or sign up and do nothing, we know already that less than 1% of IBOs reach platinum. We also know that an IBO dedicated to the "systems" such as BWW or WWDB have a lot of associated expenses such as functions, travel, cds and other materials. Thus a platinum, after expenses is likely making very little net income, if any. A study done in Wisconsin, while a bit dated, revealed that platinums in that State, averaged a net loss.

That is the truth. Seems like some IBOs can't handle it.

28 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hey It's Jose, former IBO. It's funny that you say that because I am no longer allowed to post to Amway's facebook page. I tried to explain how expensive the Nutrilite CLA is compared to Now Foods CLA Extreme. My post was deleted.

amwayusa said...

Joecool: Amway IBOs are Business Owners. Business owners need to understand the value of the time and the limitations.

There is a reason why the Amway IBO from TX that you mentioned doesn't allow your negative poison. With your consistent commitment to negativity about everything, there needs to be somebody who can encourage the Amway IBO community with a little bit of positive aspect of this phenomenal company.

We are not sure if you approve all opposition to be publish here or not, but the reason we write this is because even for now allowing, you will have to read this and that's all that matters at this point.

Bless your heart!

Joecool said...

You are mistaking the truth for negativity. What negative poison? Why don't you allow anything but rosy comments on your blog? Something to hide?

I do not delete any comments, even if negative towards myself, unless they are spam, or way off topic. You can see this as I have posted all of your comments.

Amway IBOs do not understand the value of time and limitations or they would do somethin more productive with their time. That's the truth.

quixtarisacult said...

Hey Joecool! I love this post. Your writing is exceptional and only getting better. The sad truth is IBOs really can't handle the truth. Aren't they taught to ignore and avoid the negative on the web? A form of brainwashing.

I've always known you to be fair in publishing the pro and con comments. The fact that the pro-Amway folk are reading your blog and commenting proves that many potential Amway victims are being reached. Keep up the good work my friend.

Joecool said...

QIAC, good to see you! Good to see that your blog is active again also. I'm glad that the word is gettin gout. Hopefully I have the ability to keep this blog going for years to come.

amwayusa said...

Jaycool, Appreciate your consistent attempt to provide misleading information.
However, as a business owner, the info you shared with us is uselsss because neither it says anything positive nor it seems conclusive about anything or anybody.
On the other hand, we are business builders, uplifting people and their dreams. Our job is to help people, encourage them to learn something, do something positive for their family, do more and be more in their life. Our goal is not to scare them away.
The problem with you and your friends is, you are doing everything possible to scare people off, but you are offering nothing of HOPE.

If you had something better to offer, your opinions would have been probably of any value. But this way, you are just a dream stealer, nothing else!

Thanks anyway for your try!

Joecool said...

Perhaps you would like to share with my blog audience, what you find misleading about the information here? Would you also care to share what information is useless?

How am I doing "everything possible" to scare people off? I write blog articles. I don't force anyone to come here are read my blog.

I do have better options for people than Amway. Stay home and spend time with your family and friends. Watch TV, get a second job. All much better options.

Good luck to you!

Anonymous said...

Why can't IBOs use what ever means they want to advertise their businesses and grow retail customers? Like Wal-mart or Target, they should be alowed to compete in the market. Why cant they??? Why does amway have a Retail Sales Rule while limiting the ability of an IBO to make a sale??

Anonymous said...

I have read a few pages of your blog and you mention in most of them that your biggest problem is with the 'tools' business. I am in the UK and started Amway at the beginning of this year and I actually have never even been told to buy any tools, there is a seminar this saturday in a hotel near the amway centre in central London, and that costs £5 a ticket, so I don't know what $100+ seminars you are referring to, i guess this seminar is part of the tools but I have to say I spend more money on my weekly lunch than if i went to all the seminars that Amway holds in a year in London.
You also mentioned about buying CDs, and I have to admit that I do listen to CDs but I have never bought one either, our upline lends us theirs to copy into itunes and then we return it back to them, we do the same thing with my downlines. Also a monthly fee? I don't pay any monthly fee and there certainly isn't a joining fee either, I completed my contract and could start selling and buying straight away. Amway isn't as hard as so many people make it out to be. My upline is my mum, she started Amway in London less than 3 years ago, and she is a founders platinum, I joined after I graduated from university. My mum's 'career' was beauty therapy, she is 45 years old and has worked all her life to support our family yet because of Amway she has been able to quit her job (3months ago) and dedicate her time to Amway full time, which I would rather my mum do than spend all her day doing massages and pedicures. My mum has never told me Amway is the only thing I should do in life, she never said 'you can get stuck working for the rest of your life if thats how you want life to be', she encouraged me to pursue my dreams but i decided to stat Amway because I saw the potential. Amway is not for everyone, it isn't a scam, you CAN make money out of it and using my mum as an example, she lives a normal life but she has replaced her job which is something she could not have imagined 3 years ago.

Joecool said...

The tools business was reigned in after the UK nearly shut down Amway in the UK. If you read about the facts of the case, you'll see why.

Less than one half of one percent of UK IBOs made any money.

Elie said...

Yes I agree that's very true. Many of the IBOs are in fact of financial dificulties, and many of them do lie about that fact. The real truth is though, a lot of them whem they invite you to a meeting they never disclose what it's really about.

Anonymous said...

Hi All, I am from South Africa, and thought it be good to also tell my side of the story.

A few years back, I was working for a IT company. One of our bigger clients phoned me and said he would like to give me a "job opportunity", and would like to meet with me at a local shopping mall so we can discuss it. When I got there that afternoon, he took me into a presentation...AMWAY! The most boring 3 hours of my entire life! People on stage amping up the audience, and talking about so much money and holidays and free time that it sickened me. Only saying what is good about Amway, only mentioning the positive. People walk out of there with no idea of negative, only seeing money. No idea of the amounts of time they will need to spend on marketing, driving from door to door and begging people to join. Now, we South Africans are not easy people! We HATE telemarketing, people trying to convince us we now need to buy a very expensive product although in 20 years we never had use for it. We don't like to be approached and offered a product. If we want something we will go and look for it. With that being said, an Amway rep who mislead me with the word "job opportunity" and having me sit through all that crap, and the idea that in our country we need to approach strangers and tell them about an opportunity that sounds exactly like a pyramid scheme, will not work. It will be very difficult to work your way up to holidays and money etc. Yes, there are people who show me how much they made with Amway for a month, but they soon quiet down when I ask them how much they spent that month on calls, travel and time talking to people. Also, their products, I found equal quality at cheaper prices in our local supermarket.

It is no new news that South Africa is almost always in the spotlight over political views, bad economy, and bad economy because of political views. So for your average SA person, driving around back and forth, meetings with clients at Amway sites, getting new clients, we would eventually cut off our main source of money, live in loss, just to be able to say, "hey, I made money by not doing any work. Look, Amway works! I spent R1000 ($125) on feul and made R480 ($60). But it works, cause i got the money at the end of the month. Next month I'll try harder, and drive more, and make more money!"

This is a very neutral post. If you want to join Amway, have a lot of time on your hands, go for it. Try and get as many people under you as soon as possible, so you don't have any losses in money. But please, don't use the misleading words that have been used to get me to go to that 3 hour waste of life. If Amway uses correct ways of approaching people, it would already be 10x better. And yes, it all boils down to reputation. Because after a second meeting (this time refeered to as a "prosperous business opportunity") I was told that Amway does not advertise by any other means than word of mouth. Imagine a person comes to you and says: "So you can make a hell of a lot of money, and at Amway, we are only here to help you, no other reason (BullSh!t, no one does thing for free to a complete stranger). But don't advertise it! And don't talk to anyone about it until we had this or that meeting."

It all makes people feel that it is some kind of underground movement that will eventually monopolise and we will have no other choice. Scares people off...

Sorry, I got carried away. I actually just wanted to post that they charge us R55 ($7) to join. So see how passionate we are about things that irritate us?

Regards,

Stephanie said...

i'm a undergrad student studying engineering and have a part time s job ranging from 19-24 hours a week. A few people i know are trying to get me into this "business" i've seen loads of good things and bad, and my first instinct is to say no, cus i do NOT have a business bone in my body, and personally i think its really pathetic to call people and ask them to buy products off u. i mean hello? talk about using ur personal relationships for proffesional stuff.

but i'd like here from people what they think should be my action considering my current status as a student and part time working person, cus honestly the people just don't get no and if its not as bad it looks i might just do it for the extra pocket money.

i have a few questions.
how long does it take to get ur first bonus?
is it time consuming or just something to do side by side?
is it actually as pretty and fairy light as it seems or is that just one in a 100 people?

Stephanie said...

and wats an upline? the person who introduced you to this manipulating excuse of a business?

Stephanie said...

i'm a undergrad student studying engineering and have a part time s job ranging from 19-24 hours a week. A few people i know are trying to get me into this "business" i've seen loads of good things and bad, and my first instinct is to say no, cus i do NOT have a business bone in my body, and personally i think its really pathetic to call people and ask them to buy products off u. i mean hello? talk about using ur personal relationships for proffesional stuff.

but i'd like here from people what they think should be my action considering my current status as a student and part time working person, cus honestly the people just don't get no and if its not as bad it looks i might just do it for the extra pocket money.

i have a few questions.
how long does it take to get ur first bonus?
is it time consuming or just something to do side by side?
is it actually as pretty and fairy light as it seems or is that just one in a 100 people?

Joecool said...

Hi Stephanie,

Amway's bonuses are issued monthly so you would have to qualify each month to keep receiving bonuses. If you move 100 points (minimum), which is about $250 to $300, you would get about $10 plus any profit you might make from selling products. You should check the catalogs and prices to see if making sales is realistic.

You could work Amway casually but that is likely to result in negligible results. Even hard work fails to produce results at times since you work on commissions (basically).

Based on Amway's number, about 1 in 100 reach the platinum level, generally considered a milestone achievement in Amway.

stephanie said...

So i'm assuming as a student its impossible to do this?

personally I just nodded and agreed to whatever this man was telling me. I was like sure extra pocket money and no work. works fine. but i guess there is more to it than that. Its just a couple of weeks back i did my research when i found out it seemed a little to fishy. and no offence to people who do it(Actually yes offense) but amway seems a little tacky and cheap if u will? i mean calling up people and telling them to buy your stuff. I personally believe if a product is good, its gonna sell itself you don't need 100 people to sell it for you, but here i realized most of the buyers are the business guys..
and wat's/who's an upline? the person u introduced u? so basically these guys make money out of my work, and if i become successful, the other people work hard and i earn money from thm and the people above me earn from them and that's how it goes?

Joecool said...

Yes, your upline is the person who sponsored you and some others above. They are supposed to help you but yes, they will get some of your bonus. It's possible to make some money in Amway but the amount of effort needed is tremendous. If you are as student, it might take away from your studies and some upline might discourage you from finishing school.

Take a look at the catalogs and prices and see if you think you can make some sales. At least then you can make a good decision.

Blahs Bloos said...

cool, that was of great help!

Anonymous said...

hey there

i have been asked to join the amway/IBO thing and i wanted to know how they are able to brain wash into thinking you can make a profit and what the real reality is behind their theory.

And i also wanted to know if this wayne callender guy really did get succesful through this amyway thing or that was his way of selling us the deal

Joecool said...

Do some research if you plan to join. Do an actual neutral price comparison as well. Not sure who Wayne Callender is.

Anonymous said...

Really appreciate this blog. I've been approached to join, but I'm the kind of person who breaks down everything mentally in a matter of seconds and found that though they say it's not all about sales, IT IS; and, if you're not a sales shark, then the prospects of you making it all worth it, is really not going to work out for you. And sure, they "laugh" at the idea of being referred to as a Pyramid system, but it really is. Perhaps not the most typical of pyramids, but a pyramid nonetheless. The more money you make, they more your uplines make. And while you are required or "advised" to make a certain level of sales to secure your bonuses, if you don't acquire (fruitful) downlines - people you introduce to the business you are making money too - you can kiss any additional income toodles.

I was just about ready to jump right on in, because they make it sound so easy. Then it hit me - anything that sounds so easy, is as hard as they come. So I started my own digging into the pros and cons of the business. (Thanks again for the blog) I can talk to people...but really, I know I'm not the bloodhound of a sales person I need to be to make it in this business so I might as well sit it out.

Joecool said...

Thanks for your comments and I'm glad my blog was helpful.

kanly said...

You have to stay long enough to understand the bussiness it doesn't take 5months to understand the whole thing, pyramid scheme? I was thinking of that at the beginning but at any job you go is like a pyramid right there's always somebody on top of you right? The manager, general manager,CEO unless your the owner nobody is on top of you. Now this business though it's ppl and everybody thinks and acts in adifferent way, now amwaytelling you if you work hard you can make up to 10 thousand and here is the hard part you have to change yourself first habits like stop being lazy or being selfish and be humble and so many more things you have to change in order to get those 10 thousand you have to be a better person you can't give 10 thousangisomebody selfish rude ignorant it takes time but i guess it worth it. If you spend 10.years at your job you will get a raise of 5 bucks maybe less that so we should think about this twice. I heard about quixtar but I'm not part of quixtar. Don't blame your uplines about your failure they are people just like you and me and they make mistakes maybe they don't take the best choices but they do their best this is what ilearn in team vision.
thanks.

Joecool said...

Being the nicest guy you can won't change the fact that the Amway opportunity as a business sucks.

Anonymous said...

Although the product are high quality most of them are overpriced. Even if they are not overpriced (i.e. the quality of the product justified the higher price) it is difficult to convince people that they should switch mail order product that they used to buy at the grocery store or Wal-Mart for half the price. There is also a ton of competition. 90% of the other network marketing companies out there have products that compete with one or more of Amway product lines, often at a more attractive price.

Joecool said...

I would argue whether Amway products are even of high quality. That's just one of the reasons used to justify the high prices.

Anonymous said...

It is part of selling you the deal...