Tuesday, October 2, 2012

Amway IBO Tidbits Or Sad facts?

So many people get duped into thinking that they will somehow get wealthy by becoming an Amway IBO. Many recruiters will tell stories about how they were once broke, but signed up, endured challenges and now they are diamonds enjoying untold wealth and luxuries. People get caught up in "dreams" and are often encouraged to ignore the facts. People running businesses should pay close attention to the facts because it tells you much about your business and your likelihood of success. But what are some facts about the Amway business that many people don't know about? I have outlined a few important ones for those who harbor dreams of going diamond.

1. The average diamond, according to Amway, earns less than $150,000 a year. Yes, some of this may be supplemented with money from the sale of tools, but after taxes and business expenses such as travel to and from the many functions that a diamond attends would leave a diamond living an ordinary middle class lifestyle, not one with mansions and sports cars as portrayed in many functions or meetings. Yes, a Q12 diamond would have more earnings, but a Q12 diamond is the exception, and not the rule.

2. Most IBOs are NEVER able to sponsor a single downline. Pretty hard to develop six (6) downline platinums when most people cannot sponsor anyone.

3. Most Amway products are purchased by IBOs and not sold to customers. Name a real business that sustains itself by having it's own workers or salesforce purchase most of the goods. MLM is probably the only business where this occurs. Understandably, it explains why 99%+ of "system" Amwayers make nothing or lose money.

4. For most IBOs, the cost of functions, standing orders and other support materials represent the reason why most business building IBOs lose money and it also represents a significant profit for some of the diamonds who sell the materials.

5. Not working hard is not necessarily the reason for someone's failure. But conversely, working hard does not equate success in Amway. I would guess that out of those who work hard, it is still a fraction of 1% of hard working IBOs that even attain a significant profit. Doing nothing won't get you anywhere, but in this business, working hard often gets you nowhere as well. It is my informed opinion that the cost of the support materials is the direct reason why so many IBOs lose money, even out of those who work very hard.

I could go on and on, but these are a handful of facts that IBOs and information seekers should be aware of. I welcome differing thoughts and opinions.

23 comments:

Anonymous said...

Thanks Joecool; is this all coming with your personal experience as an IBO?

Joecool said...

There's an about me clip on the side of this blog. Check it out.

Anonymous said...

Hello, Joecool.

I'm wondering where you get your facts from?

"Many recruiters will tell stories about how they were once broke, but signed up, endured challenges and now they are diamonds enjoying untold wealth and luxuries"
There are no Amway 'recruiters'. The people who speak on stage and on CD are current business builders who are talking about their own experience in business. Most people start with an average to low quality of life and want a chance to succeed. I've heard plenty of personal accounts of people who were doing well financially prior to becoming business builders and then went on to build a succesful company within the Amway sales model.

"The average diamond, according to Amway, earns less than $150,000 a year"
Fact: the 2012 Business overview (which is goverment reviewed and sanctioned for distribution) states that the average Diamond Amway IBO makes $600 000 yearly. Again, please review your facts. MOST people who achieve a Platinum level or above are shown how to build a proper business with Q12 parameters. Also, Diamonds and often pins below that level are flown to almost all events by the company, not on their own dime.

"Most IBOs are NEVER able to sponsor a single downline. Pretty hard to develop six (6) downline platinums when most people cannot sponsor anyone"
Fact: MOST IBO's sign up and then don't put in the effort it requires to actually be succesful. If you want to sponsor someone, you have to get off the couch, out of the house, and talk to people. I would suggest regularly. I've met plenty of people who hate their current living situations that can't get ahead in a job and have looked at this opportunity as a possible solution. (hint: not everyone chooses to join.....why? who cares? Not everyone wants to be a real estate agent either. As a rule, I nor my organization ever pressures people or uses sales tactics to get people to join. If they don't get it that's their god given choice. I decided it was a good opportunity for me and my family. I'm sure others will too. And by the way, we've been kinda lazy, and still sponsored more than 6 people-who go through a multi meeting information process and never get signed up on the spot) Plenty of people join, and then decide they can't or won't give up their Karaoke Wednesday nights, Basketball Tuesdays, and TV shows every other night, and then quit and start some blog about why it didn't work for them.

(post 1 of 3)

Anonymous said...

(post 2 of 3)

"Most Amway products are purchased by IBOs and not sold to customers. Name a real business that sustains itself by having it's own workers or salesforce purchase most of the goods. MLM is probably the only business where this occurs. Understandably, it explains why 99%+ of "system" Amwayers make nothing or lose money"

Fact: Ever heard of Robert Kiyosaki? Author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad? How about Frank Luntz? How about John Maxwell? (to name a few) Huge successful leaders worldwide that built their business in ways other than MLM, who fully endorse MLM as one of the best ways to become a succcessful entrepreneur in todays economy. Who has $1M to open a MacDonalds? Not many people. Who has $167 to open an Amway business? Almost everyone.

"For most IBOs, the cost of functions, standing orders and other support materials represent the reason why most business building IBOs lose money and it also represents a significant profit for some of the diamonds who sell the materials"

Fact: Here's what we teach our group to do: Buy some products that you will use on a regular basis from your own store. Switch SOME shopping habits to start from wherever you regularly shop to yourself. I have a few examples that allow people to spend about $400 at their own store monthly, which gets them a crapload of snack and granola bars, multivitamins that actually work, and some drinks to give away as samples or drink themselves. Also a few other products that they can pick and choose from. It's flexible and I have several options. This gets them a return check of no less than $128 each month, which more than covers the cost of any CD's, books, major function tickets, travel, etc that they will need if they want to build a large business. If you are going to get into medicine, knowledge of human anatomy is essential right? Well, if I want to communicate effectively, lead people, and understand their needs, I need to read books on communcation, personalities, and relationships. Make sense?

Anonymous said...

(post 3 of 3)

"Not working hard is not necessarily the reason for someone's failure. But conversely, working hard does not equate success in Amway. I would guess that out of those who work hard..."

What is your definition of working hard? This sounds like a pretty unsubstantiated claim. 'I would guess.....' isn't even a fact or number. That's based on your impression or best guess. Well my claim is this(and it's based on experience): If you actually make an effort to get into a conversation with someone, find out if they're happy doing what they're doing, and if they're not, offer them an opportunity to sit down with you for coffee so you can show them the business model most people will say no, or they will pretend they're interested and give you their number because not returning your phone call is easier than saying no to your face. Welcome to the age of the internet. Some people will say yes. Of the people that sit down with you, about 2 out of 10 will be interested in getting into business. Of all the people that get into business with you only a third will put in enough effort to be successful.
Those are the numbers, my friend. Not only does building this business take hard work, (which I and everyone I know or meet was and is told the first time they're shown the business model) but the numbers are repeated at nearly every 'function' you speak so negatively about, so there are no dissolutions. At least not in my organization.

Lastly, anything you choose to do in life if you want to do something great or live well is going to take hard work. Think about what most people spend their life doing: watching TV and working for someone else. When we work for someone else most of us are content. Some people arent but don't know how to get ahead. I'd like to help those people if I can. Honestly. If I help someone make $2000 per month I earn about $100 off of that. How much does your boss make off you?
When people watch TV they spend all those hours watching someone else doing something exciting. Actors who have worked hard to get where they are and are essentially living their dream life, reality TV contestants who are living it up, and Athletes who had to work very hard to have a chance to be successful at what they do, and are now doing exactly what they dreamed of their whole life.
I chose to stop watching other people living their dreams, and building my own. I chose to stop putting in every bit if my heart and soul to the Vet Clinic I worked for and help build that business ownwers $1M home in the suburbs andstart working on the side for myself. Not everyone's dreams are all about money and big homes and cars.
Mine, for example, is to give huge amounts of money and toys to Santa's Anonymous every year because I was raised in poverty and most Christmases, the best thing I got was from them. I also have a dream to open up a shelter for animals and fund it entirely myself without need for government donations and fundraisers. I want to be able to put my children in the programs and sports they want to be in, and not have to say NO because we can't afford it, like my mom had to tell me every time I begged her to go into ballet lessons.

My message to you:
Please stop killing other peoples dreams and opportunities to succeed just because you might have had a bad experience or whatever your story is.
You know some of mine, I hope this makes you think twice about what you're doing here on this blog. Also, I was unable to find your story....
Jenn, Alberta, Canada

Anonymous said...

I am not sure it is relevant to say most people can never sponsor. This maybe true but surely is a reflection of the people rather than the business; If someone is not able to sponsor then they never should have got in and certainly should not spend money on tools. It seems to me that to sponsor you just need to show the plan often and there are always people illing to have a go. Seems also that cold contacting works and hence you can never run out of people to show the plan to. Eventually you will hit on the type of people able to run this business themselves.Remember all the leaders in Amway were sponsored in and then just ran with the business.I agree Diamonds probably make just a middle class income and not million dollar incomes and I also agree spending money on tools is a waste of time and of course will cause losses; You can just go out and show the plan and sell a few products without any of these tools

amwayscam said...

Dear Anonymous, I know Amway is on an internet clean-up mission. I can show hundreds of topics with title negative to Amway but inside all boasting about Amway. Second thing, people like me and Joecool are not interested to say something against Amway for the sake of it. We went through the trauma and that's why we cannot stop writing! Your decision need not be based on our experience but do not ruin later.

Joecool said...

Kiyosaki and some of these others, including the diamonds are making more money selling training than they do by actually running their business. Kiyosaki advocates for Amway but doesn't build an Amway business.

Joecool said...

You should check your facts. The average "founders" diamond makes 600K. A founders diamond is the exception and not the rule. Not all diamonds on stage are business builders. Some are living behind the pin. Amway says once a diamond, always a diamond.

Joecool said...

Hi Jenn, how does me writing a blog kill anyone's dreams? Did I force people to read this blog? I don't understand how authoring a blog can kill someone's dreams.

Anonymous said...

Amwayscam. I cant figure out what your first sentence is saying. Thanks also for your last line. Im not intending to join amway. I just have a view to share

Anonymous said...

jenn, you're an idiot. plain and simple.

amwayscam said...

Dear Anonymous, I do not live in the United States of America. However, all these great authors did nothing in their lives than writing some books! They do not own any business they do not have any practical experience in building an organisation in reality. For me these financial advisors' so called teaching is just an opinion, I know how Amway affiliated books work. Can you tell me why someone has to read a new book every month for five ten years? I am not even interested to defend my point of view simply because you should go and do Amway business with or without system and make lots and lots of money! I know it can never happen because Amway business does not create an asset. Do you know facebook? That was an idea converted into asset, Amway books and CDs are never going to get resale value. Then what is Amway? Up to you to define, Amway things do not qualify as a business.

Anonymous said...

message to jenn alberta
having people spend money on tools when the profits of this goes into the pockets of downlines is just theft. i can agree that the plan as shown is acceptable as a business proposition and it is up to anyone joining to make it work themselves; but the tools element is fraud and deliberately so. Overstating the promise is not desirable but no different from coca cola or any other brand convincing people to buy something they dont need. knwing that 95 % of recruits will drop out but misleading them to spend on tools in the meantime is a disgrace. these tools areof no benefit at all. here in Europe there are no tools mainly due to language barriers and the business works fine without them

Anonymous said...

Hi anonymous.

I'd love to know why you think calling me an idiot is justified.
I read your posts. They sound reasonable. Aren't we all just stating opinions and arguments here? Let's keep the juvenile name calling out of it and behave like reasonable people.
Or, alternatively, you could try to make an argument that actually has some clarification, not just a petty remark about someone you don't even know.

Anonymous said...

After re-reading my post, you're right. I shouldn't have made a comment about stealing dreams. It reads kinda lamely and to be honest I was just trying to sum up an argument. Your blog is your own, you have every right to post your opinions, just as I am. If reading a blog convinces someone to quit a goal or forget about a future they're working towards (whatever that future is) then they're not going to get anywhere....
Jenn

Anonymous said...

It's not about working HARD, it's about working SMART.

Maybe you should go over your past work plan and compare it to someone who has had success in the business. I bet you can find a few differences.

Joecool said...

Are you claiming to have had success in the Amway business? If so, please explain.

Joecool said...

Jenn,

I understand what you're getting at, but I guess my point is that the Amway leaders promote dreams, which is fine, but who exactly is achieving any of these dreams because of the Amway business? Because most people make nothing or lose money in Amway, I don't see Amway as a realistic or viable way to achieve any financial dreams.

Anonymous said...

Just thought I should clarify that Jenn from Alberta and another anonymous are not the same person....it sounds like I'm going on a wild rant and I've only made two comments here.
Joecool...I've since found your story, read most of your website and been quite objective. I agree with alot of your comments and disagree with alot of them as well. Yes, I am a current IBO. And yes, I read one of your posts and got a little wild and defensive, and then got called an idiot in the process.

I'm really just looking for an outside view, but when you come in all hot from 'the other side' it's difficult at first not to be offended when you hear someone cutting up what you have believed for some time is going to be your whole future. I'm here because despite some successes we've had alot of failures. And I'm wondering.......
well, you know.
Sorry for getting so wild and crazy on you.

As for the anonymous who name calls and doesn't have the courage to actually state his name or where he's from.....what is your story? Why so angry, friend? Have you been successful in the Amway business or are you just accusing of me of working stupidly without justification? Just curious.
J. Alberta

Joecool said...

Thanks for visiting my site. I get a lot of traffic and comments and Amway is a controversial subject so don't take any comments personal.

My objective in running this blog is to provide information for readers to see what my experience was like because many of the leaders I saw in person were unethical and sometimes outright liars and they are still teaching pretty much the same things to this day.

Anonymous said...

+1

Anonymous said...

hello, cool joe. no need to defend yourself. if people don't like what they read on here, they don't have to read it. we live in a free country. the truth can hurt, and will always cause some sort of controversy, but it's still the truth. as i said, it's a free country. accept it or not. :)