Tuesday, May 26, 2009

Amway - Show Me The Money?

I find it humorous when so many IBOs talk about their anecdotal stories of success, or talk about how their system teaches a foolproof way of succeeding in Amway. Yet I have not seen a single IBO who was willing to describe their business structure or talk about how they progressed from zero PV into a profitable structure. Amway's biggest defender, IBOfightback is a good example of someone who can talk a good game but cannot back it up with evidence of any success in Amway. Back in my IBO days, someone who could talk a good game was a teacher, and not a doer. Many IBOs may have a good theory about how to build a business but evidence clearly shows that it is talk and not action. One specific example is how an IBO is supposed to find 20 customers who each buy 20 PV from an IBO. Amway's own numbers show that an IBO who can actually do this is rare or non existent. Less than 4% of Amway's products, apparently are sold to those who are not IBOs. IBOfightback sits in the quiet confines of his blog where his kool aid induced followers blindly agree with everything he says. Apparently, IBOFightback is all theory and no results. So I say - show us the money someone.

Based on my observations, most IBOs have a small business, unable to sponsor enough downline to move any significant volume. They faithfully self consume 100 PV and do most of the CORE steps, except for being able to consistently show the plan and sponsor downline. Why is this? It is because the Amway reputation is stained and getting people to see the plan is an enormous challenge by itself, not taking into consideration that sponsoring is even harder. If you are reading this blog and you can relate to what you see here, perhaps you need to re-think your business situation and ask your sponsor some tough questions.

Now this leads to another question. Other than flashing a photocopy of someone's diamond bonus or the like, has your sponsor or anyone upline actually showed evidence of a profit in Amway? If you asked, what response did you receive? When I asked my sponsor about profit, I was told it was "none of my business". I believe that someone who is asking you to follow their system, which is not free, should be tasked with providing this information. If your upline teaches submission to upline, even more so you should demand to see results.

If your upline or sponsor refuses to show you evidence of profit, it should send up red flags all over the place. Maybe, just maybe, the critics of Amway are onto something.


Anonymous said...

JoeCool you sad excuse for a man. Why should IBO's show you their finances? Why don't you write about how much you make from your job? Why should people read your blog if you don't display your finances?

Joecool said...

Anonymous, my blog is about Amway. Amway IBOs recruit others into their businesses. They make unsubstantiated claims about their income in order to get people interested in the business. In any REAL business, showing financials is not even a question. Why is it an issue for Amway IBOs? Something to hide?

mrmaximum said...

I had posted this before and I guess I need to post this again. Where I work, my business got sold (and no, I do not need to worry about my job.) This was a case of a huge company wanting to get a hold of us for expansion from a not so big company. Even though the little company I work for with all 14 people in it wouldn't even make up a FRACTION of the accounting department of the company that sold us.....the transaction took over a year.

That's right, over 14 - 18 months. Why, their accountants checked and then rechecked our books and records. They wanted to know about our assets and liabilities. THEN they had lawyers who wrote up documents in regards to these numbers. My point?

If you are trying to tell me that large businessmen like Donald Trump and the like or even smaller ones like the small shop owner on the street corner never look at financial statements, then I have a bridge to sell you!!

Okay, let's try this, ever try to buy a house with out people looking at your financials? Then when they ask you tell them "None of your business?" What happens then?

Yeah....you don't get that house...PERIOD. Same thing with a car, same thing with anything of value. If you have what you say you have, there is no problem in showing it. I drive a grey 05 dodge ram? Want pictures? No worries, I have no problem showing something that I own. It would be a bit harder to show someone a ferrari that I don't have.

Joecool said...

Mr. Maximum, good post. Also, an IBO should think about when someone is selling you a business. Would you buy it on the seller's word that he is successfl? Would yo buy a business if the seller shows you a copy of a large check he had a few years ago? The answer is no, but IBOs seem to think this is fundamental business practice in Amway.

Anonymous said...

Joe, You have posted a blatently inaccurate post, beginning with your first paragraph. From the time I put Amway on my Google Alert list, I have explained in detail to you, both my profit in the business, my expenses in my first couple of years and where my income comes from. I have also discussed with you the structure of my business as a qualified Founders Emerald with 4 Platinum legs and a 5th that pops over from time to time. I have discussed the myth that money merely comes with a pin, but rather in proper structure and balance of a business. The only defense that was offered up was from a girl named "Gina" that couldn't get past her college professors insitance that ones Balance Sheet and P/L Statement was the only thing that could possibly legitimize an Amway business.

As I said, I offer you the respect that anyonone deserves by not lumping everyone who has not built an Amway business into the loser category, and acknowlege that you appear to be an intellegent individual, but please do not write up postings that are blatantly not true and expect no confrontation.

Joecool said...

Anonymous, can you tell me what is blatantly inaccurate about my fist paragraph? You have described your business somewhat, in very general terms. And If I may add in, you are probably VERY exceptional and not the norm for the vast vast majority of IBOs.

I welcome challenges, but you need to specify what you are challenging.

mrmaximum said...

Interesting challenge and I have at least to applaud you anon for at least giving SOME background of your business. However, what is meant by the profit and loss statements is that ANYONE can make claims such as this. Anyone can talk about how profitable their conveniece store is, how many customers their cleaning business has, and how much money I make per annum.
The reason why the bank, other businesses and accountants, heck, even the IRS in the states and the CRA in Canada, is that THOSE STATEMENTS ARE THE PROOF. These documents PROVE everything that you say you have, otherwise we would have many more Enrons floating about.
This is what I find so interesting about this post. See, there are teams in Amquix which are absoltue horrors and give the business a bad name, and there are others who aren't so bad. If people have such a negative idea about Amquix, if so many people think the business doesn't work but YOU have made it work and are making money. Then by showing some proof you are differentiating yourself from the other groups who are simply siphoning money from the masses.
It's simply put up or shut up, if you have it, then show it, if you insult, berate, or call people silly for asking a BASIC acounting principle, then it undermines your position.
Fine, I'll play too, my wife makes 7,000 a month from her cleaning business. You should simply take me at my word because I mean, asking for a balance sheet is simply stupid, right?

Gina said...

Seriously??? This can't be stressed enough...an IBO should show his business financials because when an IBO is recruiting someone they are telling them..."do as I do and you will make money", "Duplication", ect..why if you are telling someone to do as you are cause look at all that money you make wouldn't you show the proof? Why si this difficult? It is standard proceedure in ANY business, other than Amway. The mere fact that IBO's continue to say that they will not share such standard and basic business information just supports further the fact that IBO's do not run their business like a business, do not know basic business operating skills, and do not keep, and probably don't even know what or how to keep a P/L.

The only way an IBO can accurately say that they have disclosed their business finacials is by presenting a P/L...one can outline all they want but that holds as much water as a strainer.

Anonymous said...


Based on my current experience in Amway, there are bonuses and PV uplifts- when you sell products worth more than $75 to a registered customer. So how do the honesty and Integrity preaching uplines teach their IBO's to do this- They ask the IBO's to register their family/friends and neighbours as customers and ship their own purchases to these fake customer's addresses so that they can taek advantage of bonuses and 20% volume uplift. After all the preaching about honesty and Integrity and what not and preaching about how the kids in business have great values- this is uplines teach their newest IBO's. When v questioned our upline about this- he had the guts to tell us "quixtar has this 20% volume uplift rule and know thta ppl might misuse it, why do they still have it- for IBO's to take advantage of it."

So new IBO's u know how honest and what integrity ur upline has if they ask u to take advantage of the 20% PV uplift rule.