Monday, September 13, 2010

Amway - IBOs Are Fraud Victims?

I've heard over the years, many IBOs who failed in the Amway opportunity who blamed themselves for not putting in enough effort, not trying hard enough or not working the system. While I don't doubt that some IBOs don't work hard enough, I cannot fathom that so many motivated and eager prospects simply failed because they didn't work hard enough. I believe IBOs are taught to accept failure as their own.

Uplines will tell new IBOs to trust them and that these new IBOs will succeed if only they will follow the advice of the allegedly successful diamond because they have already blazed the trail for you. Ironically, after many IBOs fail, upline will never take responsibility for the advice they issued that led to downline failures. They then turn the tables on their donwline and say that their advice is like a buffet. You pick and choose the advice you need and disregard the rest. That is such a bunch of crap that I cannot fathom downline IBOs buying what they are shoveling. A new IBO places their trust in the diamonds because they have achieved the pinnacle of success but a new IBO is supposed to pick and chooe which advice to follow? And then failure is the fault of the downline?

Ironically and sadly, thse downline, when they ultimately fail, often end up blaming themselves and just disappear unless someone recruits them again. They are often sponsored by friends and family so you won't see them filing complaints against Amway or the uplines who led them astray. Uplines nearly assured their success if only these new IBOs would buy the training materials and attend all of the functions. But many IBOs work hard and do everything outlined by upline only to fail. It is likely because the system doesn't work. Many financial systems are for sale out there and most of them have very little success. Amway is no different, except that uplines promote their systems as sure fire.

It is however, my belief that many or possibly most IBOs are the victims of fraud in that they are given possibly false positive information about the Amway opportunity. They get involved and find out that the system doesn't work, and then they end up quitting with a loss and them blaming themselves. Brilliant for the uplines who profit but in my opinion, it makes IBOs the victims of fraud by upline. Upline profits whether or not their downline makes a cent. Some upline strongly encourage downline to buy more and more tools, even when they know that those downline have no chance of making money in the Amway opportunity. It makes the IBOs victims and it makes the uplines a bunch of crooks.

40 comments:

Anonymous said...

JoeCool, IBO's are not fraud victims. You are the fraud. Functions and tools are optional. What don't you understand about optional? Nobody has to attend functions. Nobody has to buy anything. How can it possible be fraud?
Your just bitter and full of it.

colin said...

anon, you say the same nonsense as bridget n insider.

Joecool said...

Yes I know. I am bitter and that's why IBOs lose so much money from purchasing tools. What a crock. The upline supposedly have credibility and they use that credibility to encourage downline to buy tools. The tools don't work and basically, the downline get sucked into a scam.

colin said...

Wasnt amway shut down in the uk for being a scam? I heard they where very close to being shut down in china also. How can something legit have this happen?

Joecool said...

My understanding is that Amway was under close scrutiny in the UK and was threatened with being shut down. BWW and network21 were also scrutinized. I believe Amway made concessions to avoid being shut down. Ironically, the UK investigation resulted in Amway lowering prices and Amway controlling the tools business. I think the US should do the same.

Anna Banana said...

Anonymous, you're correct that Amway rules say that purchasing tools and attending functions is optional and Amway goes on to state that the sponsoring upline must still provide support and training whether or not IBO's buy tools and go to Amway meetings. The reality is upline tells the IBO's if they don't purchase tools and attend Amway meetings then they'll know they're not a serious business builder and they won't work with them. They use cult tactics to sway IBO's to purchase the tools. Joecool is correct in stating that IBO's are victims of fraud. Can you give us insight on why IBO's tell their downline they refuse to work with them if they won't purchase tools when that's a violation of Amway's optional policy?

Anonymous said...

Amway supporters will keep saying that this does not happen in their system or in this day and age.

All talk about tools, function being optional is total crap. I would have heard a million times "tools are optional, but so is success". Or they would say something like, "if you are not willing to invest in ur business, why should ur upline be willing to work with you?"

When you sign up u will be told there is no quota to buy products and you can save 30% by redirecting your anyway spending money. But soon you will start receiving calls from your upline on the last day of the month if you dont complete 100PV and then you would be bombarded with training about why you should consume high quality vitamins and after a few months you would be expected to complete 300PV and that too on the first day of the month.

colin said...

anon, people have a choice to smoke or not smoke but we all know smoking is harmful to a persons health.

salix said...

Amway was not shut down in UK and China. Problem with you guys is that you are victims of your own idiocy and you spread it like a cancer to those around you.

Joecool said...

Salix = Anonymous from Scarborough Canada.

I must say you are getting creative with making up names.

colin said...

When i baught none of the tools,baught very little product,and no seminars i had no help from my upline diamond or direct. Was told if i didnt support the business with buying tools etc ...they want nothing to do with me. Which was fine with me at that time i thought the products where overpriced

colin said...

The other thing some amway leaders in my neighborhood is doing is convincing young people they dont need a college/university education. That they'll be better off building the business and working partime. So they have these kids working crap jobs and buying overpriced tools.

Joecool said...

That is disturbing that some people do not help downline unless they buy tools. A sponsor is obligated to train their downline free of charge.

It's also unconscionable for young kids to be told to skip college for the Amway business.

Anonymous said...

HAHAHA! My team upline is 22 years old, single and halfway through college pulling in $67K/year from Amway... better than that job which keeps you time/money-wise stressed out like hell until you retire broke because of old age/sickness. His future family is gonna be free and he's gonna spend time with his wife and kids. What about you guys? HAHAHA!

Joecool said...

Anonymous from Canada, care to verify your claim? What about all the downline? Losing their asses?

Joecool said...

BTW, you act like $67K a year is the cat's meow.

That's not that much income.

Anonymous said...

$67K/year certainly is three times my job's income. To me buddy, that's quite a bit much of an income. I'm single and I can retire on that income. Of course, that's just the beginning. Aiming for the millions. What, you're jealous?!

colin said...

Anon, My life been awesome since quitting amway years ago. I've been able to retire ahead of schedule and stay in thailand 6 months a year. I use to hear Greg duncan talk about retiring but he's bankrupted owing people lots of money. Not sure if amway distributors ever retire. Life isnt all about money and how fast you retire. I cant put a price tag on not having to attend those annoying amway meetings & seminars. Also having a fake smile with a annoying sales pitch to all your prospects.

Joecool said...

Anonymous, if you are earning only $22,000 a year you need to find a better job. Also, an IBO earning $67,000 is not taking home that much. After taxes and business expenses, I bet that IBO earns maybe $2000 a month and it's less than that because a lot of the Amway money is paid in the form of an annual bonus.

colin said...

Anon, You should quit mcds and go back to school hahaha. Im from Vancouver Canada and the bus drivers here make 25/h to start and they often get overtime at 37.50/h. Dude 67k/year isnt much money.


Anonymous said...

$67K/year certainly is three times my job's income

Anonymous said...

colin, good for you, now bye bye. I'm not going into fruitless debates with you.
joecool, i don't need to find a better job for the following reasons:
1) no time & money leveraging
2) no tax advantages
3) no job security
4) no personal and financial freedom, just being told what my schedule is day to day and how to live
5) no possibility to expand based on your own goals and dreams
6) no life, just stress and lots of bills versus whatever money is left after lots of tax
With Amway, these concerns are eliminated but not overnight. It takes work, effort and dedication. If you're really serious, you'll look for a way out and if not, you'll look for a way to make an excuse.

Joecool said...

You have no time and money leveraging in Amway. Name a few diamonds who built a diamond business and do nothing but collect checks in the mail while sipping mai tais on the beach?

You have no real tax advantages in Amway that I can speak of.

You have no security in Amway. Even though you are an IBO, you are still at Amway's mercy.

Personal freedom. See my first answer.

Of course you can expand in a job. It's called a promotion. Your expansion in Amway is a continuous recruitment of new IBOs, most of whom will do nothing or quit within the first year.

You don't have less stree or less bills because you join Amway.

Anonymous said...

Why don't you spend a week with a Diamond couple and see how they live life together with this business? What stops you from picking up your phone, call that couple and ask them 'I would like to be your guest for one week, I would like to learn how you live as a result of Amway so that if it's true I can live alike." Laziness? Guilt? Fear of embarrassment and correction maybe?

Joecool said...

Why would I want to associate with unethical crooks? What would I see? Probably a very middle class lifestyle and lots of credit card bills. A diamond lifestyle cannot be sustained with diamond income.

Anonymous said...

There's no 'probably' here. You seem to love probability more than certainty. But to be a credible source of information on Amway, you must leave probability and go for certainty. So when are you going to pick up that phone and call a Diamond couple requesting to spend a week with them to learn about Amway the right way?

Anonymous said...

@anon: Why should he bother calling a diamond when there are so many IBO's out there making it VERY clear why you should stay away from the cult that becomes amway. Perhaps if the diamonds were teaching their downline properly, or perhaps recruiting IBO's that weren't crazy, things might be different. But maybe the crazies become diamonds? Unfortunately I have yet to see that... just broke.. oh and still crazy.

Anonymous said...

You know something... no arguments with you because... I AM CRAZY, BLOOOODY CRAZY AND YOU'RE RIGHT, I AM TO BECOME D.I.A.M.O.N.D! Ai papi!

Joecool said...

More like cubic zirconia. LOL

Anonymous said...

lol :p

Anonymous said...

I don’t know what the guy on top is talking about. I stepped away for a year after setting up 1 down line. Came back 1 year later and realized I’ve been missing out on $600 a month. Now I’m on it and making buck’s baby. Amway Global has the best and largest quantity of products in the world while having the most amazing business plan ever conceived by man. Growing at an unstoppable rate of expansion, you buy everything at low cost or become your own I.B.O. to get paid to shop. This is an amazing, real, an easily obtainable path to success. Get in now for immediate prospect of financial freedom. Do the research and the math; discover the triumph of life security for those worried for the future of themselves and their families.
www.amway.com/truguerra

Joecool said...

How can you miss out on $600 a month? You get nothing unless you have the side volume or don't you know what that is?

Anonymous said...

i rather go to school and get my job earning 70k+ instead of sell vitamins and other pointless shit online

Anonymous said...

Long time reader- first time poster.
I see you got ohein56 banned from scam.com Way to go
Keep up the great work the world needs moer joecools

Vikram Singh said...

Yes that's right they(N21) are doing the same thing in India. I have been their victim and have lost two precious years of my life. But now i am slowly getting back on track anyway it's never too late. But those Amway people still call me and say Vikram forget about the Govt job or education. build Amway it's the only right thing in the world.

i have had tough lessons to learn.

Anonymous said...

I am curious how many young people have they pulled away from College. My Nephew was in College, he college paid for because he was playing football. They convinced him to drop out.
Just wonder how many young people they have victimized in this way? Anyone, heard of this happening?

Anonymous said...

Amway and its various supporting subsystems don't want young prospects to go to college for two reasons. First off, they don't want you to spend all that tuition and book money when you could be sending it to them in the form of fees and purchases of Amway products. Second, Amway has a very pronounced anti-intellectual streak. The most energetic Amway proponents are proud of their basic ignorance and stupidity, and have nothing but contempt for anyone who reads a book other than one promoted by Amway.

Amway freaks tell prospects that going to college is a waste of time, and that they should instead be "building their business" by selling overpriced Amway crap and convincing their family, friends, and neighbors to do the same.

Anonymous said...

Many of my friends have dropped out of school to pursue Amway.

Joecool said...

Sorry to hear that. Provide them with information if you can. It may help.

Anonymous said...

I've shown them statistics. It doesn't process correctly!

Anonymous said...

As we can see from a number of recent threads here, many Amway people are impervious to logic, and freely admit it.

That's scary.