I keep hearing from some IBOs that they belive that Amway has created more millionaires than any other company in the US. I call BS on that claim. I am not saying that Amway hasn't created any millionaires, obviously, the Amway owners are worth billions of dollars. But what the IBOs are apparently implying is that the diamonds are millionaires. I'm sure there are some diamonds who indeed are millionires, especially if they are tenured diamonds, in particular the double diamonds and higher. But conversely, I believe that many high level diamonds are not millionaires. I believe it is just as common for a diamond to be in debt as it is for a diamond to be living large. I also believe that many diamonds did not accumulate their alleged wealth exclusively from Amway.
The reason why this is an issue is because these big pins will stand on stage and show off excessive wealth and imply that it is their Amway income that pays for these mansions, sports cars, and in some cases, jets. In the US, I attended a function called "Dream Nite" where these kinds of trapping are displayed, to the tune of the song "I wanna be rich". The diamonds would say that you can have what they have, if only you will do what they advise. These functions still go on today and I believe it is now called Winter Conference.
Stanley and Danko's book, "The Millionaire Next Door"
http://www.personalfinanceplaybook.com/2009/08/the-millionaire-next-door/
This book makes some very interesting points which I believe applies to Amway diamonds. I will outline the significant ones and I will comment below:
**Predictably, the data shows that most people who you believe to be very rich are not.
**High net worth individuals, statistically, tend to be people that live within their means. They don’t spend a lot of money. They don’t waste money. They tend to be pretty frugal people.
**The authors point out that most of the richest people you know aren’t driving expensive luxury automobiles. That’s what the people who want everyone to think they’re rich drive.
Joe's commentary. The book does say that about 1/3 of millionaires acquired their wealth thru a J-O-B and saved and invested, but did mention that many millionaires were also business owners, such as a pest control company, etc. But based on the points made by the book above, I can see where it is likely that diamonds portray a wealthy lifestyle as a recruitment tactic, when the reality is they may be living very middle class lifestyles off stage, or may even be in debt. I have seen evidence of diamonds having their homes foreclosed and being in debt (Ruth Carter's book: Amway: Behind the Smoke and Mirrors). Recently, there was also a report that Triple Diamond Greg Duncan filed for chapter 7 bankruptcy. The report indicated that he could not make his mortgages, or something to that tune. Odd, because when I was in WWDB, some of the upline leaders said diamonds paid cash for everything because paying interest to the bank wasn't very smart.
My question is why IBOs continue to make up these claims? Try googling millionaire or Amway millionaire. There is nothing to indicate that Amway was responsible for creating the "most millionaires" of any US company. If this were true, wouldn't Amway state it on their website? If someone finds any veracity about this claim, inform me and I will post it.
Wednesday, August 31, 2016
Tuesday, August 30, 2016
Amway Versus A Job?
One of the ways that upline diamonds would put down jobs was to toss in the phrase that a job was simply trading hours for dollars. As if it were demeaning to have a job where you got paid for your time. I believe it's all relative. Being that many IBos are young and maybe working in more entry level types of jobs, then yeah, your hourly wage might not be that great. If you earn say $10 an hour, then you might be struggling financially and it may take time before your skills and knowledge increase to a point where your experience is worth more money. What if you had a job paying $1000 an hour and earned $160,000 a month? Is that a lousy deal trading hours for dollars? I think not!
Conversely, having a business can be good or bad also. If you have an Amway business earning less than $100 a month and you spend $200 on functions, standing orders and other training and motivational materials, then you are losing money. You would be better off working for free. That is still a better alternative than working a business where you are losing money. I think most people agree that a platinum group typically has a 100 or more IBOs. Thus a platinum is in the top 1% of all IBOs. I have heard that the platinum level is where you start to break even or make a little profit, depending on your level of tool consumption. If platinums are barely making a profit, then the other 99+% of IBOs are likely losing money. How much is that worth per hour?
I think uplines cleverly trick IBOs into thinking that a job is bad. Trading hours for dollars, afterall, sounds like some kind of indentured servant of sorts. But in the end, what matters is your bottom line. If you are an IBO with little or no downline, and/or not much in terms of sales to non IBOs/customers, then you are losing money each and every month if you are attending functions and buying standing orders. Your 10-12 hours a week of Amway work is costing you money! But if you spend 10-12 hours a week, even at minimum wage, then you might be making about 300 to 350 a month gross income. After taxes, you make about 250 to 300. At least trading hours for dollars gets you a guaranteed net gain at the end of the month.
Uplines trick you into a "business mentality" where you think that working for a net loss is just a part of business. IBOs should realize that a business promoted as low risk and no overhead should be one where you can profit right away. Instead, IBOs are taught to delay gratification, or to reinvest any profit back into their business in the form of tools and functions, which results in a net loss. If that's the case I would choose trading hours for dollars.
Remember, trading hours for dollars is not a bad deal if you are making enough dollars per hour. And even those who make less, are better off that those who "run a business" but end up with a net loss. It's all relative and hopefully, this message will help new or prospective IBOs who are being enticed to join the Amway business opportunity. Good luck to those with jobs and those with businesses. You can be successful either way. Remember that!
Conversely, having a business can be good or bad also. If you have an Amway business earning less than $100 a month and you spend $200 on functions, standing orders and other training and motivational materials, then you are losing money. You would be better off working for free. That is still a better alternative than working a business where you are losing money. I think most people agree that a platinum group typically has a 100 or more IBOs. Thus a platinum is in the top 1% of all IBOs. I have heard that the platinum level is where you start to break even or make a little profit, depending on your level of tool consumption. If platinums are barely making a profit, then the other 99+% of IBOs are likely losing money. How much is that worth per hour?
I think uplines cleverly trick IBOs into thinking that a job is bad. Trading hours for dollars, afterall, sounds like some kind of indentured servant of sorts. But in the end, what matters is your bottom line. If you are an IBO with little or no downline, and/or not much in terms of sales to non IBOs/customers, then you are losing money each and every month if you are attending functions and buying standing orders. Your 10-12 hours a week of Amway work is costing you money! But if you spend 10-12 hours a week, even at minimum wage, then you might be making about 300 to 350 a month gross income. After taxes, you make about 250 to 300. At least trading hours for dollars gets you a guaranteed net gain at the end of the month.
Uplines trick you into a "business mentality" where you think that working for a net loss is just a part of business. IBOs should realize that a business promoted as low risk and no overhead should be one where you can profit right away. Instead, IBOs are taught to delay gratification, or to reinvest any profit back into their business in the form of tools and functions, which results in a net loss. If that's the case I would choose trading hours for dollars.
Remember, trading hours for dollars is not a bad deal if you are making enough dollars per hour. And even those who make less, are better off that those who "run a business" but end up with a net loss. It's all relative and hopefully, this message will help new or prospective IBOs who are being enticed to join the Amway business opportunity. Good luck to those with jobs and those with businesses. You can be successful either way. Remember that!
Monday, August 29, 2016
Amway's Path To Financial Disaster?
When I saw the Amway plan, it was presented sort of as a raod to riches. Yes, the presenter was careful not o say it was "get rich quick", but 2-5 years is relatively quick when compared with working 40 hours a week for 40 years as the business plan was shown to us. And while some exceptional people do achieve diamond, there is a trail of IBOs who suffer losses, some of them staggering. In our own group, I know of at least one couple who lost their home following upline advice, and another couple to ended up filing for chapter 7 bankruptcy. I must state that the bad advice leading to bankruptcy and foreclosure most likely came from upline leaders. I also know of a gal who quit her job to attend a function, faithfully following upline advice from WWDB.
So what is the experience of many CORE IBOs? I'm not talking about those who "do nothing", but IBOs who actually make an effort. Well, if they do their 100 PV, then they are spending about $300 a month and dedicated IBOs will typically spend about $200 a month on average for tools. This is for a single person. A couple or family would be expected to do more, thus spend more. So for these 100 PV IBOs, they will expend about $500 a month and get back maybe $10. Of course if they were not in Amway, they would still have some expenses for household goods, but not anywhere near $500 a month.
Over the course of a few years, these expenses add up and can become staggering losses. Hard core IBOs might expend even more. The only way a rank and file IBO can gain relief is to sell products (which is difficult given the prices and the Amway name reputation) or to sponsor downline who wil then suffer some of the losses for you. It would be my estimate that an IBO might break even at about the 4000 PV level. However, at 4000 PV, you might have 30 to 40 downline. The catch is that only about 1 in 5 IBOs manage to sponsor another IBO.
Over the years, I would suspect that millions of IBOs have come and gone through the Amway opportunity, and probably lost billions of dollars. But many of those who lose money think they are successful, because many upline will edify those who buy tools, regardless of IBO results. After a few months, if your group and PV are not growing consistently, it is highly unlikely that you are headed for success.
IBOs and newbies, are you on the road to riches or financial disaster? Keep in mind that a net loss is not success, despite what you upline mentor may tell you.
So what is the experience of many CORE IBOs? I'm not talking about those who "do nothing", but IBOs who actually make an effort. Well, if they do their 100 PV, then they are spending about $300 a month and dedicated IBOs will typically spend about $200 a month on average for tools. This is for a single person. A couple or family would be expected to do more, thus spend more. So for these 100 PV IBOs, they will expend about $500 a month and get back maybe $10. Of course if they were not in Amway, they would still have some expenses for household goods, but not anywhere near $500 a month.
Over the course of a few years, these expenses add up and can become staggering losses. Hard core IBOs might expend even more. The only way a rank and file IBO can gain relief is to sell products (which is difficult given the prices and the Amway name reputation) or to sponsor downline who wil then suffer some of the losses for you. It would be my estimate that an IBO might break even at about the 4000 PV level. However, at 4000 PV, you might have 30 to 40 downline. The catch is that only about 1 in 5 IBOs manage to sponsor another IBO.
Over the years, I would suspect that millions of IBOs have come and gone through the Amway opportunity, and probably lost billions of dollars. But many of those who lose money think they are successful, because many upline will edify those who buy tools, regardless of IBO results. After a few months, if your group and PV are not growing consistently, it is highly unlikely that you are headed for success.
IBOs and newbies, are you on the road to riches or financial disaster? Keep in mind that a net loss is not success, despite what you upline mentor may tell you.
Friday, August 26, 2016
Amway IBOs Fail By Design?
So many IBOs quit and fail, I think the Amway corporation might need a calculator to keep track. And of the IBOs who work and try hard, most of those IBOs also end up in failure and losing money. After years of blogging about Amway, I believe it is because the uplines and the tools they sell to help IBOs are ineffective. When I was an IBO, I don't recall many tools that contained information teaching me how to run a business or how to run an Amway business. There was no talk about tracking income and expenses. In fact, our group was advised to ignore the facts. The scary thing about this is that it is evident that some groups are still teaching this.
Many IBOs and prospects are lured into the business by displays of wealth and not because of bonafide and verified business credentials. A friend of mine sold his franchise business a few years ago and part of what he provided to the prospective buyer was the last three years of his tax returns, personal and business returns. But try asking an upline to even see a business profit loss statement or a schedule C business tax return and you are likely to be told it is none of your business. Instead, upline may show off a photocopy of a bonus check which may be an annual or a once in a lifetime bonus. Or upline may show off a sports car as evidence that they are successful. Sadly, some of these uplines might be broke, they may owe back taxes to the IRS and/or they may even be in debt but simply showing off wealth.
Some uplines have the nerve to discourage young people from furthering their education because they would rather they channel their money into Amway and tools. Some people are told to make family sacrifices to attend more functions or to buy more standing orders. I will grant that not all uplines do this but based on my experience, I would say more uplines do this than not. They will apply subtle pressure on new IBOs and the newbies probably don't know much about Amway or business so they basically have to choice but to trust a diamond who has allegedly achieved the pinnavle of success in Amway. Then uplines will often betray their disciples by saying that failure is the personal responsibility of teh IBO. That advice needs to be discerned by the new IBO and bad advice should be discarded, as if a new IBO would know what is good or bad advice.
I aso see experienced IBOs who don't seem to know how taxes work. I see IBOs who were given the impression that Amway is easy and that they will work once and enjoy the fruits of their labor forever. Oddly, I don't know of a single IBO who did the work once and sat back collecting residual income forever. I find it odd that even tenured crown ambassadors continue to keep busy work schedules. I suppose they could just enjoy this lifestyle but still I find it odd that nobody I know of could specifically name an IBO who achieved diamond and higher and sat back collecting income while enjoying the beaches of the world.
Seems that IBO turnover and failure is more common than not in the AMO world. It also appears that incoming IBOs are like fuel to a fire. Without continuous recruitment and replacement of IBOs who quit, the organization would eventually fall apart along with the bonuses that the higher ups enjoy. It is my informed opinion that many IBOs fail because they aren't taught sound business principles. Despite the constant flow of cds, voice messages and functions and meetings, it doesn't seem as if any practical information is passed from upline to downline. Only messages of never quitting and continuing to dedicate themselves to the system. The result is inevitable and the expected result is failure. That failure is by design, expect the IBOs don't see it.
Many IBOs and prospects are lured into the business by displays of wealth and not because of bonafide and verified business credentials. A friend of mine sold his franchise business a few years ago and part of what he provided to the prospective buyer was the last three years of his tax returns, personal and business returns. But try asking an upline to even see a business profit loss statement or a schedule C business tax return and you are likely to be told it is none of your business. Instead, upline may show off a photocopy of a bonus check which may be an annual or a once in a lifetime bonus. Or upline may show off a sports car as evidence that they are successful. Sadly, some of these uplines might be broke, they may owe back taxes to the IRS and/or they may even be in debt but simply showing off wealth.
Some uplines have the nerve to discourage young people from furthering their education because they would rather they channel their money into Amway and tools. Some people are told to make family sacrifices to attend more functions or to buy more standing orders. I will grant that not all uplines do this but based on my experience, I would say more uplines do this than not. They will apply subtle pressure on new IBOs and the newbies probably don't know much about Amway or business so they basically have to choice but to trust a diamond who has allegedly achieved the pinnavle of success in Amway. Then uplines will often betray their disciples by saying that failure is the personal responsibility of teh IBO. That advice needs to be discerned by the new IBO and bad advice should be discarded, as if a new IBO would know what is good or bad advice.
I aso see experienced IBOs who don't seem to know how taxes work. I see IBOs who were given the impression that Amway is easy and that they will work once and enjoy the fruits of their labor forever. Oddly, I don't know of a single IBO who did the work once and sat back collecting residual income forever. I find it odd that even tenured crown ambassadors continue to keep busy work schedules. I suppose they could just enjoy this lifestyle but still I find it odd that nobody I know of could specifically name an IBO who achieved diamond and higher and sat back collecting income while enjoying the beaches of the world.
Seems that IBO turnover and failure is more common than not in the AMO world. It also appears that incoming IBOs are like fuel to a fire. Without continuous recruitment and replacement of IBOs who quit, the organization would eventually fall apart along with the bonuses that the higher ups enjoy. It is my informed opinion that many IBOs fail because they aren't taught sound business principles. Despite the constant flow of cds, voice messages and functions and meetings, it doesn't seem as if any practical information is passed from upline to downline. Only messages of never quitting and continuing to dedicate themselves to the system. The result is inevitable and the expected result is failure. That failure is by design, expect the IBOs don't see it.
Thursday, August 25, 2016
Amway Dreams Or Reality?
One of the things that many IBOs are badly misguided on is the concept of dreams and fighting for dreams. A dream is basically a long term goal. Someone might dream about playing in the National Football League. To accomplish that dream, one might play high school and/or college level football. For most, the dream will end unsuccessfully. No matter how much someone wants to play in the NFL, only so many people are proficient enough to be able to make the team. Even fewer are elite players that become stars. So while you might fight for your dreams, there is also an alternate reality.
In the Amway business, via the "systems" such as WWDB or Network 21, the leaders will often sell hopes and dreams to the downline. That the downline can be retired at the age of 29, walking the beaches of the world while the income just rolls in forever and ever. These kinds of "dreams" would be the same as hoping to win the powerball lottery. You may have seen a few who did it but the chance of you duplicating it is very unlikely. Slim to none is your chance in reality.
Another things uplines will often do is tell anecdotal stories about crabs keeping each other in a bucket when one tries to escape, or about monkeys preventing each other from grabbing bananas at the top of the pole. While the stories may be interesting and even true, it doesn't necessarily apply to the Amway business. While it is true that an IBO may have friends and family who are skeptical about Amway, it is with good reason. Many people have gone through the Amway business with no success. Many people have lost money doing everyting they were advised to do by upline. There is a track record of financial disasters associated with Amway and the attached "systems". It's not like there's a long list of people who have walked away from Amway with the cash rolling in and not a care in the world. Ever wonder why none of the crown ambassadors have exercised the option to "walk away"?
I think people should have dreams. I think people should pursue their dreams. I also think people need to know that certain dreams can come true. There also needs to be a degree of reality in their dreams. There will always be some inspirational person such as a "Rudy" who overcame great odds to accomplish a dream, but the untold reality is that there were probably many many young men who dreamed of playing for Notre Dame that year. Likely, no one else accomplished the unlikely dream like a Rudy. What I am saying is that earning a nice income and having the option of early retirement can be acomplished in many ways. You might be choosing to use Amway to accomplish your financial dreams and that is your right. But the reality is that very few people have made all their financial dreams come true due to the Amway opportunity, as compared to the tens of millions who have tried.
Keep fighting for your dreams, but keep in mind that you might need a plan B and a dose of reality.
In the Amway business, via the "systems" such as WWDB or Network 21, the leaders will often sell hopes and dreams to the downline. That the downline can be retired at the age of 29, walking the beaches of the world while the income just rolls in forever and ever. These kinds of "dreams" would be the same as hoping to win the powerball lottery. You may have seen a few who did it but the chance of you duplicating it is very unlikely. Slim to none is your chance in reality.
Another things uplines will often do is tell anecdotal stories about crabs keeping each other in a bucket when one tries to escape, or about monkeys preventing each other from grabbing bananas at the top of the pole. While the stories may be interesting and even true, it doesn't necessarily apply to the Amway business. While it is true that an IBO may have friends and family who are skeptical about Amway, it is with good reason. Many people have gone through the Amway business with no success. Many people have lost money doing everyting they were advised to do by upline. There is a track record of financial disasters associated with Amway and the attached "systems". It's not like there's a long list of people who have walked away from Amway with the cash rolling in and not a care in the world. Ever wonder why none of the crown ambassadors have exercised the option to "walk away"?
I think people should have dreams. I think people should pursue their dreams. I also think people need to know that certain dreams can come true. There also needs to be a degree of reality in their dreams. There will always be some inspirational person such as a "Rudy" who overcame great odds to accomplish a dream, but the untold reality is that there were probably many many young men who dreamed of playing for Notre Dame that year. Likely, no one else accomplished the unlikely dream like a Rudy. What I am saying is that earning a nice income and having the option of early retirement can be acomplished in many ways. You might be choosing to use Amway to accomplish your financial dreams and that is your right. But the reality is that very few people have made all their financial dreams come true due to the Amway opportunity, as compared to the tens of millions who have tried.
Keep fighting for your dreams, but keep in mind that you might need a plan B and a dose of reality.
Wednesday, August 24, 2016
Amway And WWDB?
In looking back at my IBO days, I can now laugh at some of the weird stuff we did, and believe it or not, I have reason to believe that my old LOS, WWDB still teaches some of this and some other major groups also teach it. I believe some of these practices were the reason why some people refer to the Amway business as cult or having cult like qualities. If you recognize some of these practices, you might be in an unethical group and you should ask your upline the tough questions and possibly reconsider or reprioritize your involvement in the business, especially if you can't get straight answers to your questions.
Submission to upline was one of the things we were told. Our group was told that upline would never purposely lead us astray so we should trust them and never try anything without checking upline. Afterall, upline had experience and probably had all the answers. Some of this checking upline included asking permission to get married, buy a car or a home, or even something as small as purchasing a camera. The upline said maybe someone upline might have advice on how to get a good deal on a camera so no harm in checking upline before making a purchase. It is my guess that upline didn't want your disposable income being spent on anything other than standing orders and functions.
Late meetings. Our upline was into late meetings, many occuring after midnight. I suppose it was a show of loyalty and dedication to the upline and the system. In reality, it made most people angry at their jobs because they had to wake up early to go to work. For me it made me mad at our upline because the meetings taught us nothing of substance and it just made us tired. Our upline used to talk about time being important but it was never important enough to make him show up on time for his own late night meetings. Another cult like factor - sleep deprivation.
Secrets. Anytime we asked about how much income uplines may have been earning, we were either told it's none of our business or shown a photocopy of a 5 year old bonus check that someone upline may have received. Our proof that the business worked was upline showing off pictures of sports cars and mansions. Of course we now find that some WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed, and one prominent triple diamond had some dealings in bankruptcy court. Looking back, I suspect that many diamonds have mortgages, which would be nor problem except that these leaders scoffed at the sutpidity of having a loan. That diamonds pay cash for everything, including homes. My former sponsor still lives in a run down rented home beause he won't purchase a home unless he's got the cash. My former sponsor is a physician so I find his position on buying a home preposterous. His oldest child, a son probably grew up deprived of his parents because of dedication to the system and the functions.
Losing money is success. Many times, our group was told that losing money was a sign of success. It was success because we were investing in our futures. That the business really is not about money but about friendships. I suppose upline taught this because everyone was losing money so it was nice to hear that success was around the corner, and that we were all nicer people and on our way to success if we just attended more functions and bought more standing orders. People who sold off some of their personal property were edified if they did so to attend a function. Obviously these folks were not advised to run their business within their means. Upline even said that going into debt was okay, but only if the debt was to invest in the business or to buy extra function tickets.
While some of these practices seem bizarre, I believe it is because the upline advice was self serving and meant to channel their downline's dollars into tool purchases. It is the only conclusion I can make.
Submission to upline was one of the things we were told. Our group was told that upline would never purposely lead us astray so we should trust them and never try anything without checking upline. Afterall, upline had experience and probably had all the answers. Some of this checking upline included asking permission to get married, buy a car or a home, or even something as small as purchasing a camera. The upline said maybe someone upline might have advice on how to get a good deal on a camera so no harm in checking upline before making a purchase. It is my guess that upline didn't want your disposable income being spent on anything other than standing orders and functions.
Late meetings. Our upline was into late meetings, many occuring after midnight. I suppose it was a show of loyalty and dedication to the upline and the system. In reality, it made most people angry at their jobs because they had to wake up early to go to work. For me it made me mad at our upline because the meetings taught us nothing of substance and it just made us tired. Our upline used to talk about time being important but it was never important enough to make him show up on time for his own late night meetings. Another cult like factor - sleep deprivation.
Secrets. Anytime we asked about how much income uplines may have been earning, we were either told it's none of our business or shown a photocopy of a 5 year old bonus check that someone upline may have received. Our proof that the business worked was upline showing off pictures of sports cars and mansions. Of course we now find that some WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed, and one prominent triple diamond had some dealings in bankruptcy court. Looking back, I suspect that many diamonds have mortgages, which would be nor problem except that these leaders scoffed at the sutpidity of having a loan. That diamonds pay cash for everything, including homes. My former sponsor still lives in a run down rented home beause he won't purchase a home unless he's got the cash. My former sponsor is a physician so I find his position on buying a home preposterous. His oldest child, a son probably grew up deprived of his parents because of dedication to the system and the functions.
Losing money is success. Many times, our group was told that losing money was a sign of success. It was success because we were investing in our futures. That the business really is not about money but about friendships. I suppose upline taught this because everyone was losing money so it was nice to hear that success was around the corner, and that we were all nicer people and on our way to success if we just attended more functions and bought more standing orders. People who sold off some of their personal property were edified if they did so to attend a function. Obviously these folks were not advised to run their business within their means. Upline even said that going into debt was okay, but only if the debt was to invest in the business or to buy extra function tickets.
While some of these practices seem bizarre, I believe it is because the upline advice was self serving and meant to channel their downline's dollars into tool purchases. It is the only conclusion I can make.
Tuesday, August 23, 2016
Amway Upline Conmen?
The really insidious part about some of the LOS leaders, such as the ones I had in WWDB, is that they apparently are cutthroat ruthless businessmen with nice suits, and disguised as your mentors and friends. They get you to trust them, and they will tell you that they have your best interest at heart, or that they would never purposely lead you astray. On the surface, you may think this is true, but look at their actions and you can easily discern that some of these uplines are absolutely ruthless businessmen who would take every cent from you if they could. I was in WWDB and I have good reasons to believe that they are still doing this, based on a WWDB IBO blog. On this blog, I see all the same teachings today, that I heard as an IBO and some of the same claims such as buying homes in cash. It's scary.
As an IBO, the diamonds would tell you to never miss a function, ever. The only good reason for missing a function was for your own funeral. I recall some crossline IBOs rearranging pre-planned anniverssary parties, weddings, and other special family events in the name of being core and attending all functions. Some IBOs actually did quit their jobs to attend functions and they very well may have done so because some uplines taught this. IBOs were also encouraged and told to go into debt to attend a function. This was okay because it was an investment into your business.
Our group was also strongly encouraged to buy extra cds every week. To be core, you needed to listen to a cd each day and you cannot listen to the same one each day right? Couples were told to buy their own seperate standing orders. Brad Duncen even had a true north tape (cd) that said sponsors were to eat the standing orders for downlines who quit because it was too much trouble to call upline who calls upline who calls upline to cancel a standing order. Oddly enough, they didn't mind upline calling upline calling upline to add a standing order.
In the end, I was lucky enough to have been progressing up the pin ranks so my losses were not that devastating. I ended up losing in my early months of the business but mostly broke even when I was at 4000 PV. Sadly though, my crossline did not fare so well. I know of one couple who declared bankruptcy. I don't know how much their WWDB involvement contributed to bankruptcy, but I am certain it was a major factor and I know of two couples who had homes foreclosed, and I believe that their allegiance to WWDB was a factor in those foreclosures. But I guess hey, two WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed so maybe they were duplicating?
Do not be fooled. The diamonds may have a nice smile and a nice suit, but they are ruthless businessmen who will take your last dime if you allow them to.
As an IBO, the diamonds would tell you to never miss a function, ever. The only good reason for missing a function was for your own funeral. I recall some crossline IBOs rearranging pre-planned anniverssary parties, weddings, and other special family events in the name of being core and attending all functions. Some IBOs actually did quit their jobs to attend functions and they very well may have done so because some uplines taught this. IBOs were also encouraged and told to go into debt to attend a function. This was okay because it was an investment into your business.
Our group was also strongly encouraged to buy extra cds every week. To be core, you needed to listen to a cd each day and you cannot listen to the same one each day right? Couples were told to buy their own seperate standing orders. Brad Duncen even had a true north tape (cd) that said sponsors were to eat the standing orders for downlines who quit because it was too much trouble to call upline who calls upline who calls upline to cancel a standing order. Oddly enough, they didn't mind upline calling upline calling upline to add a standing order.
In the end, I was lucky enough to have been progressing up the pin ranks so my losses were not that devastating. I ended up losing in my early months of the business but mostly broke even when I was at 4000 PV. Sadly though, my crossline did not fare so well. I know of one couple who declared bankruptcy. I don't know how much their WWDB involvement contributed to bankruptcy, but I am certain it was a major factor and I know of two couples who had homes foreclosed, and I believe that their allegiance to WWDB was a factor in those foreclosures. But I guess hey, two WWDB diamonds had homes foreclosed so maybe they were duplicating?
Do not be fooled. The diamonds may have a nice smile and a nice suit, but they are ruthless businessmen who will take your last dime if you allow them to.
Monday, August 22, 2016
The Unseen Part Of Amway?
I was in discussion on another forum and a comment was made about Amway being an iceberg, because you see the shiny clean ice on the top but you do not see the majority of the iceberg. Or in other words, the diamonds show you the fancy suits, jewelry, cars, mansions, jets and what you don't see is the financial carnage that takes place in their downlines at times. My former upline would tell audiences that they could skip meals to buy more standing orders because you might hear the one thing that could make your business explode.
Sure, on standing orders, you won't hear too much of the unethical and "wrong" teaching, because some of this is monitored by Amway, but it's the night owls and smaller group meetings where the real teaching is disseminated. This is where you are told to practically sell your soul to achieve in Amway. This is where the teaching comes in where you should be purchasing excessive amounts of tools in order to succeed. This is where you are told to never miss a function unless it's for your own funeral. A newbie or casual observer won't see these things but if you ever commit to becoming a business builder, this is likely to become your world.
You don't see the backstage at functions and meetings. Former rubies and platinums have made commentary about the diamonds literall laughing about how gullible the downline are. You don't see the where the cash collected at the meetings and functions go. There had been some past comments about literally, suitcases of cash leaving the premises. If your upline has a mansion and a fleet of nice cars, it's likely that your tools money played a significant part in your diamond obtaining it.
It's a simple conclusion. The tools have a higher markup than Amway products and have fewer beneficiaries to split up the bonus. A $7.00 Amway product might cost $3.00 or so to make and the rest will be bonus money split up by the layers of IBOs. Whereas a $7.00 cd might take 50 cents to produce and only platinums and higher receive any compensation from this srouce of income. But rank and file IBOs rarely ever see a true and transparent picture of this business. It is shrouded in secrecy, just like the underside of an iceberg. I challenge IBOs to be real businessmen and women and ask upline the tough questions about where the money is made. Do not accpet rhetoric and anecdotal stories. In real business, schedule C business tax returns are the normal way for verification of business income. If you are going to "invest" your hard earned money into the system to the benfit of upline, you should demand this information.
Would any of you purchase a conventional business from someone without proof that it is profitable? Why would an Amway business be any different?
Sure, on standing orders, you won't hear too much of the unethical and "wrong" teaching, because some of this is monitored by Amway, but it's the night owls and smaller group meetings where the real teaching is disseminated. This is where you are told to practically sell your soul to achieve in Amway. This is where the teaching comes in where you should be purchasing excessive amounts of tools in order to succeed. This is where you are told to never miss a function unless it's for your own funeral. A newbie or casual observer won't see these things but if you ever commit to becoming a business builder, this is likely to become your world.
You don't see the backstage at functions and meetings. Former rubies and platinums have made commentary about the diamonds literall laughing about how gullible the downline are. You don't see the where the cash collected at the meetings and functions go. There had been some past comments about literally, suitcases of cash leaving the premises. If your upline has a mansion and a fleet of nice cars, it's likely that your tools money played a significant part in your diamond obtaining it.
It's a simple conclusion. The tools have a higher markup than Amway products and have fewer beneficiaries to split up the bonus. A $7.00 Amway product might cost $3.00 or so to make and the rest will be bonus money split up by the layers of IBOs. Whereas a $7.00 cd might take 50 cents to produce and only platinums and higher receive any compensation from this srouce of income. But rank and file IBOs rarely ever see a true and transparent picture of this business. It is shrouded in secrecy, just like the underside of an iceberg. I challenge IBOs to be real businessmen and women and ask upline the tough questions about where the money is made. Do not accpet rhetoric and anecdotal stories. In real business, schedule C business tax returns are the normal way for verification of business income. If you are going to "invest" your hard earned money into the system to the benfit of upline, you should demand this information.
Would any of you purchase a conventional business from someone without proof that it is profitable? Why would an Amway business be any different?
Thursday, August 18, 2016
Quitting Amway = Winning?
I often see commentary about people quitting Amway and Amway loyalists are quick to call them broke, losers, lazy, lacking guts. Ironically, these same lazy and loser types of people were "sharp" and motivated prospects before they signed up for the Amway opportunity. Someone recently left a comment on my blog about how AMOs should conduct exit interviews with departing IBOs to get to the root of the problems. I think these exit interviews would reveal that people are working hard and applying the AMo teaching, only to lose money,
Based on my years of blogging and Amway experiences, I can honestly say I believe that people quit Amway primarily for one reason. The money isn't there. Amway's own numbers show that the average IBO earns just over $200 a month and that is before taxes and expenses, and that number excludes inactive IBOs. Business building IBOs earn most of the bonuses, but business building IBOs generally have the most expenses, often participating in the system of standing orders, voicemail, books and functions.
When I was an IBO, I did as upline advised and I achieved a fairly significant level (4000 PV), but due to the expenses associated with tools and helping downline, I didn't earn net profit. This is confirmed by a study done by the Wisconsin attroney general who examined the tax returns of platinume and found that they averaged a net loss of about $1000 a year. While the study was a bit dated, I would suggest it is still very valid as platinums today, have more tools (business building materials) that they are expected to buy from upline. If I made nothing at 4000 PV, anyone with half a brain can conclude that IBOs below 4000 PV and fully participating on the system would end up with a net loss because their expenses would be similar to mine, but with less bonus money.
The bottom line is that people are very likely quitting because they aren't profitable. If people made a few hundred a month with 8-15 hours of work per week, they would continue to run their businesses. But those who work and make nothing or lose money have no reason or motivation to continue. Thus they simply make a wise business decision and quit. What seemed like a good idea during the presentation simply did not pan out when reality set in. It's also reasonable to conclude that the products are that great either because if they were, those who quit would become loyal customers, thus even if the sales force turned over, sales would consistently rise as former IBOs would become customers. It's apparent that most former IBOs do not become loyal Amway customers. In fact, for those who later discover they were lied to or deceived about the Amway opportunity, become critical of Amway instead.
Why do people quit Amway? I think the answer is crystal clear. The quitters are the winners!
Based on my years of blogging and Amway experiences, I can honestly say I believe that people quit Amway primarily for one reason. The money isn't there. Amway's own numbers show that the average IBO earns just over $200 a month and that is before taxes and expenses, and that number excludes inactive IBOs. Business building IBOs earn most of the bonuses, but business building IBOs generally have the most expenses, often participating in the system of standing orders, voicemail, books and functions.
When I was an IBO, I did as upline advised and I achieved a fairly significant level (4000 PV), but due to the expenses associated with tools and helping downline, I didn't earn net profit. This is confirmed by a study done by the Wisconsin attroney general who examined the tax returns of platinume and found that they averaged a net loss of about $1000 a year. While the study was a bit dated, I would suggest it is still very valid as platinums today, have more tools (business building materials) that they are expected to buy from upline. If I made nothing at 4000 PV, anyone with half a brain can conclude that IBOs below 4000 PV and fully participating on the system would end up with a net loss because their expenses would be similar to mine, but with less bonus money.
The bottom line is that people are very likely quitting because they aren't profitable. If people made a few hundred a month with 8-15 hours of work per week, they would continue to run their businesses. But those who work and make nothing or lose money have no reason or motivation to continue. Thus they simply make a wise business decision and quit. What seemed like a good idea during the presentation simply did not pan out when reality set in. It's also reasonable to conclude that the products are that great either because if they were, those who quit would become loyal customers, thus even if the sales force turned over, sales would consistently rise as former IBOs would become customers. It's apparent that most former IBOs do not become loyal Amway customers. In fact, for those who later discover they were lied to or deceived about the Amway opportunity, become critical of Amway instead.
Why do people quit Amway? I think the answer is crystal clear. The quitters are the winners!
Wednesday, August 17, 2016
Amway To Retirement?
One of the things upline leaders apparently do is to disparage people with jobs. Oh, they would say we needed people to wait on our tables and clean our toilets, but in general, jobs were put down and basically the group was told that Amway is their best chance at achieving financial freedom, giving them the ability to flush their jobs. Ironically, IBO's jobs are what funds their Amway businesses. Most IBOs would be out of business within weeks if not for their job income funding their Amway businesses.
The key selling point appears to be the 2-5 years of part time work rather than working a job for 30 - 40 years and then retiring on social security which may or may not be there when you retire. This plants a fear in people about their financial future and then the Amway opportunity is presented in a positive light because the Amway opportunity comes with a low start up cost. What uplines do not mention is how the opportunity can become a money pit as the monthly defacto 100 PV quota (Approximately $300) plus the cost of tools (cds, books, voicemail, functions) starts to add up. It is my guess that if people only bought items they truly needed, these IBOs would likely move 100 PV every three months, unless they are actively selling goods to non IBO customers, which appears to be rare.
When an IBO finally agrees to register, it is then that the hidden costs are revealed. Many uplines will introduce standing orders and functions and present these tools as vital to IBO success. Most new IBOs don't know better and feel subtle pressure to conform and give it a try. Some upline may loan some tools to downline in the beginning but evemtually, the IBO will be encouraged to be a "serious" business owner who should be purchasing their own tools to loan to their downline and the cycle goes on.
If you examine some version of the Amway recruitment plan, you will see that most IBOs are at the 100 PV level, which will reward you with a monthly bonus of about $10 or so. If that same IBO subscribes to the tools system, than IBO will likely be losing over $100 a month not including the product purchases. And because many IBOs have been convinced that working a job is so horrible, that they can be convinced that this condition of losing money is temporary and that untold wealth is right around the corner. Sadly, for most, this condition is the norm and even the sponsorship of a few downline, the losses continue to mount. Yet many are convinced that this is better than a job.
Ironically, a job allows people to pay their monthly bills, feed their families and many people enjoy their work and co workers. While upline leaders may convince you otherwise, it is this very same excuse upline leaders use when asked why they are still working instead of walking the beaches of the world collecting massive amounts of residual income. I would encourage IBOs to truly analyze their efforts in Amway and determine if it is beneficial to your finances. In most cases, your Amway efforts ONLY benefits your upline's finances. For most who get involved, the Amway opportunity is not better than a job. A job provides a regular paycheck. An Amway business provides a negative cash flow for most who try it.
The key selling point appears to be the 2-5 years of part time work rather than working a job for 30 - 40 years and then retiring on social security which may or may not be there when you retire. This plants a fear in people about their financial future and then the Amway opportunity is presented in a positive light because the Amway opportunity comes with a low start up cost. What uplines do not mention is how the opportunity can become a money pit as the monthly defacto 100 PV quota (Approximately $300) plus the cost of tools (cds, books, voicemail, functions) starts to add up. It is my guess that if people only bought items they truly needed, these IBOs would likely move 100 PV every three months, unless they are actively selling goods to non IBO customers, which appears to be rare.
When an IBO finally agrees to register, it is then that the hidden costs are revealed. Many uplines will introduce standing orders and functions and present these tools as vital to IBO success. Most new IBOs don't know better and feel subtle pressure to conform and give it a try. Some upline may loan some tools to downline in the beginning but evemtually, the IBO will be encouraged to be a "serious" business owner who should be purchasing their own tools to loan to their downline and the cycle goes on.
If you examine some version of the Amway recruitment plan, you will see that most IBOs are at the 100 PV level, which will reward you with a monthly bonus of about $10 or so. If that same IBO subscribes to the tools system, than IBO will likely be losing over $100 a month not including the product purchases. And because many IBOs have been convinced that working a job is so horrible, that they can be convinced that this condition of losing money is temporary and that untold wealth is right around the corner. Sadly, for most, this condition is the norm and even the sponsorship of a few downline, the losses continue to mount. Yet many are convinced that this is better than a job.
Ironically, a job allows people to pay their monthly bills, feed their families and many people enjoy their work and co workers. While upline leaders may convince you otherwise, it is this very same excuse upline leaders use when asked why they are still working instead of walking the beaches of the world collecting massive amounts of residual income. I would encourage IBOs to truly analyze their efforts in Amway and determine if it is beneficial to your finances. In most cases, your Amway efforts ONLY benefits your upline's finances. For most who get involved, the Amway opportunity is not better than a job. A job provides a regular paycheck. An Amway business provides a negative cash flow for most who try it.
Tuesday, August 16, 2016
Former Amway WWDB Wife Speaks Out?
Amway and WWDB Teaching?
A comment left on my WWDB blog. I thought it might be helpful to other readers who share a similar situation:
My husband wasn't abusive when we met and were first married. That started happening maybe six months after we were married.
He was already in Amway when we met, but he wasn't very active. After we got married, he started to get more active in "the business."
I didn't know much about Amway when I met him. I met his upline sponsors when we got engaged and I thought they were just good friends. After we were married, I went to a rally and was struck by how the wives seemed to be so supportive. Then I heard the Emerald wife speak, and all she did was edify her husband or go on to "us gals" that we needed to let go of any negativity. As I went to more functions, I heard the wives tell "us gals" to be submissive - that we were wrong for having any needs or requests. It's one of the kids' birthday or your birthday and there's a function? Guess which one takes priority. You can celebrate later when you're "Free," when you're a Diamond.
I thought there would be some sales training. I went to an Artistry clinic - they taught us how to put on makeup and showed us some of the latest colors. But there was nothing about how to find customers, generate sales, or even have a makeup party. At one time, there was a tape by Bettyjean Brooks (wife of Jim Brooks, WWDB) about how to build a retail business. I ordered it, but never received it. She and Jim divorced. Jim stayed in WWDB and the tape suddenly became "unavailable."
Husband really followed the "fake it 'til you make it" teaching. To everyone, he was Mr. Successful. After our child was born, I became a stay at home mother. He led everyone to believe that it was our Amway income that allowed me to stay home. We weren't even at 1500 PV. We never made any money. I kept my mouth shut and played the submissive/supportive wife role. Keeping the books, running call-in and pickup for our downline, and trying to peddle the products to "customers." He never tried to sell anything - that was the wife's job. WWDB taught that.
It all came to a head when the police got involved because of the abuse. He had to move out of our house. He lied to everyone, saying that it was all really nothing and that the courts (and I) were blowing everything out of proportion. After going through counseling and therapy, it was clear to me (and to the therapist) that he was not being honest with any of us. I filed for divorce.
It was then that the upline contacted me. Our sponsor (the wife), platinum and emerald each called me. It started out that they were "concerned" about me and wanted to counsel me. When I told them exactly what happened and why I was leaving, they told me that it was "unbiblical" for me to leave my husband. Yelling at me. Accusing me of negativity. They also said that there was no way he could have done those things, that they just couldn't believe it. I offered to let them see a copy of the police report. Nobody ever took me up on that offer.
Now, I can't say that Amway taught him to be abusive, but I wholeheartedly believe they taught him to be a good liar and how to hide the truth and dodge questions. They did everything short of preach that the "little lady" stay at home, pregnant and in the kitchen. Wives on stage used to brag about how the couple drove a hundred miles and left their kids sleeping in the car while they went inside someone's house to show a plan.
Freedom, indeed. More like servitude.
A comment left on my WWDB blog. I thought it might be helpful to other readers who share a similar situation:
My husband wasn't abusive when we met and were first married. That started happening maybe six months after we were married.
He was already in Amway when we met, but he wasn't very active. After we got married, he started to get more active in "the business."
I didn't know much about Amway when I met him. I met his upline sponsors when we got engaged and I thought they were just good friends. After we were married, I went to a rally and was struck by how the wives seemed to be so supportive. Then I heard the Emerald wife speak, and all she did was edify her husband or go on to "us gals" that we needed to let go of any negativity. As I went to more functions, I heard the wives tell "us gals" to be submissive - that we were wrong for having any needs or requests. It's one of the kids' birthday or your birthday and there's a function? Guess which one takes priority. You can celebrate later when you're "Free," when you're a Diamond.
I thought there would be some sales training. I went to an Artistry clinic - they taught us how to put on makeup and showed us some of the latest colors. But there was nothing about how to find customers, generate sales, or even have a makeup party. At one time, there was a tape by Bettyjean Brooks (wife of Jim Brooks, WWDB) about how to build a retail business. I ordered it, but never received it. She and Jim divorced. Jim stayed in WWDB and the tape suddenly became "unavailable."
Husband really followed the "fake it 'til you make it" teaching. To everyone, he was Mr. Successful. After our child was born, I became a stay at home mother. He led everyone to believe that it was our Amway income that allowed me to stay home. We weren't even at 1500 PV. We never made any money. I kept my mouth shut and played the submissive/supportive wife role. Keeping the books, running call-in and pickup for our downline, and trying to peddle the products to "customers." He never tried to sell anything - that was the wife's job. WWDB taught that.
It all came to a head when the police got involved because of the abuse. He had to move out of our house. He lied to everyone, saying that it was all really nothing and that the courts (and I) were blowing everything out of proportion. After going through counseling and therapy, it was clear to me (and to the therapist) that he was not being honest with any of us. I filed for divorce.
It was then that the upline contacted me. Our sponsor (the wife), platinum and emerald each called me. It started out that they were "concerned" about me and wanted to counsel me. When I told them exactly what happened and why I was leaving, they told me that it was "unbiblical" for me to leave my husband. Yelling at me. Accusing me of negativity. They also said that there was no way he could have done those things, that they just couldn't believe it. I offered to let them see a copy of the police report. Nobody ever took me up on that offer.
Now, I can't say that Amway taught him to be abusive, but I wholeheartedly believe they taught him to be a good liar and how to hide the truth and dodge questions. They did everything short of preach that the "little lady" stay at home, pregnant and in the kitchen. Wives on stage used to brag about how the couple drove a hundred miles and left their kids sleeping in the car while they went inside someone's house to show a plan.
Freedom, indeed. More like servitude.
Monday, August 15, 2016
Is An Amway Business A Bad Joke?
I hear many Amway supporters mention that you will have a real business if you treat it like one. It is my observation that most IBOs do not treat their businesses like a real one. It is also my opinion that the Amway business itself is flawed and many IBOs, in their zeal to sponsor downline, do crazy things at times, such as tricking people into meetings, or being deceptive and misleading. Some IBOs are taught "fake it till you make it". Many IBOs never sell a product and never sponsor anyone. How can anyone build a business under those conditions. Yet that is the most common experience for newbies. Many IBOs do nothing and quit. Knowing these factors, how can anyone expect to build a business when most can't sell products or sponsor people, and when people get sponsored, most "do nothing and quit"?
Many IBOs do not bother to qualify their prospects. They will sponsor anyone who is breathing. It could be due to uplines making the business seem easy. For example, I have heard that going platinum is so easy that someone's dog can go platinum. Another mistake IBOs make is they do not look at the likelihood of an IBO succeeding. They will sponsor anyone, anywhere. Like real stores, opening a new one creates competition and I don't know of any IBOs who take this into consideration before recruiting a new prospect. The solution to a faltering business is apparently to attempt to open more "Amway stores" despite a lack of sales.
New recruits are also encouraged to partake in the teaching system, regardless of their expectations and business goals. This participation in the system is what often leads to IBO failure (business losses). They spend more on tools than what they generate in income. This heavily contributes to the poor retention rate among IBOs. Even IBOs who can progress and make some money will be simply channeling their profits to upline by their tools consumption. It is my informed guess that an IBO must reach the 4000 to platinum level before they start to break even. However, with that said, a hard core dedication to the system can render a 4000 or platinum into a lose money business. And If I might add, only about 1 in 400 IBOs reach the Gold level (source Amway.com) so you are already facing overwhelming odds just to reach the alleged break even point in Amway.
Here's the real test for an IBO. Walk into a bank. Speak to a loan officer and show the loan officer the 6-4-2 or 9-4-2 plan, whichever plan your group uses. And see if the loan officer will grant you a loan based on that plan. It is more likely that you be laughed out of the bank. Seriously, the plan only makes sense, apparently to people who are unable to properly evaluate a business plan. That's because the presentation is more about selling dreams and hopes than about running a profitable business.
Do you have a real business or a joke?
Many IBOs do not bother to qualify their prospects. They will sponsor anyone who is breathing. It could be due to uplines making the business seem easy. For example, I have heard that going platinum is so easy that someone's dog can go platinum. Another mistake IBOs make is they do not look at the likelihood of an IBO succeeding. They will sponsor anyone, anywhere. Like real stores, opening a new one creates competition and I don't know of any IBOs who take this into consideration before recruiting a new prospect. The solution to a faltering business is apparently to attempt to open more "Amway stores" despite a lack of sales.
New recruits are also encouraged to partake in the teaching system, regardless of their expectations and business goals. This participation in the system is what often leads to IBO failure (business losses). They spend more on tools than what they generate in income. This heavily contributes to the poor retention rate among IBOs. Even IBOs who can progress and make some money will be simply channeling their profits to upline by their tools consumption. It is my informed guess that an IBO must reach the 4000 to platinum level before they start to break even. However, with that said, a hard core dedication to the system can render a 4000 or platinum into a lose money business. And If I might add, only about 1 in 400 IBOs reach the Gold level (source Amway.com) so you are already facing overwhelming odds just to reach the alleged break even point in Amway.
Here's the real test for an IBO. Walk into a bank. Speak to a loan officer and show the loan officer the 6-4-2 or 9-4-2 plan, whichever plan your group uses. And see if the loan officer will grant you a loan based on that plan. It is more likely that you be laughed out of the bank. Seriously, the plan only makes sense, apparently to people who are unable to properly evaluate a business plan. That's because the presentation is more about selling dreams and hopes than about running a profitable business.
Do you have a real business or a joke?
Friday, August 12, 2016
What's Your (Amway) Business Worth?
Many many people see the Amway plan, sign up as an IBO in the hopes that Amway income will help them fulfill their dreams and that they will walk away from their jobs at a young age and collect lifelong residual income while walking the beaches of the world. Sadly, most IBOs will never even sponsor a single downline or see a net profit. These IBOs may continue in the business for a while but will eventually quit when they see the writing on the wall. Someone mentioned on another forum that people who want to work 2-5 years and do nothing thereafter are probably lazy and therefore, are not capable of achieving in anything, much less in Amway. I agree with this but even hard working eager IBOs generally make nothing or lose money.
But wait, you're an "independent business owner". So instead of quitting, why not sell your Amway business? I wonder if any IBOs actually think about what their business is worth. I mean a diamond in theory could sell their business and live large happily ever after right? Here's some food for thought. Why are there instance of diamonds quitting or resigning from Amway? Why would they just quit when they could either walk away and collect an income "forever" or sell the business? I mean do IBOs ever stop and think about this? It is an honest and serious question that should get some consideration. Honestly, why would a diamond not walk away if they could collect income forever?
I believe diamonds quit and resign because their business is worth very little or nothing. And most Amway businesses do not even generate a net profit. For IBOs who are seriously pondering on this very important message, try looking up this topic in Amway's rules. There are very complicated steps to be taken when selling your Amway business as each person upline must be offered ownership (To the best of my understanding). This process can go on for a long time and the attrition of your business could render it worthless before you can find a buyer, if you have a buyer at all. Also, if you quit, the downline in your group would be surrendered to the immediate upline anyway. So why would your upline want to buy your business?
So IBOs, I ask you. What is your business worth? You don't own your downline. They are independent owners like yourself. You should not have inventory, employees or some warehouse storage complex. Aside from the ability to add downline volume to your own, your Amway business likely has very little value in the real world. So IBOs and prospects, think about it for a minute. What is the value of your Amway business? Ever see anyone sell their Amway business or actually walk away from Amway to collect residual income? Do you ever wonder why crowns and double diamonds are still working, even beyond retirement age for people with jobs?
But wait, you're an "independent business owner". So instead of quitting, why not sell your Amway business? I wonder if any IBOs actually think about what their business is worth. I mean a diamond in theory could sell their business and live large happily ever after right? Here's some food for thought. Why are there instance of diamonds quitting or resigning from Amway? Why would they just quit when they could either walk away and collect an income "forever" or sell the business? I mean do IBOs ever stop and think about this? It is an honest and serious question that should get some consideration. Honestly, why would a diamond not walk away if they could collect income forever?
I believe diamonds quit and resign because their business is worth very little or nothing. And most Amway businesses do not even generate a net profit. For IBOs who are seriously pondering on this very important message, try looking up this topic in Amway's rules. There are very complicated steps to be taken when selling your Amway business as each person upline must be offered ownership (To the best of my understanding). This process can go on for a long time and the attrition of your business could render it worthless before you can find a buyer, if you have a buyer at all. Also, if you quit, the downline in your group would be surrendered to the immediate upline anyway. So why would your upline want to buy your business?
So IBOs, I ask you. What is your business worth? You don't own your downline. They are independent owners like yourself. You should not have inventory, employees or some warehouse storage complex. Aside from the ability to add downline volume to your own, your Amway business likely has very little value in the real world. So IBOs and prospects, think about it for a minute. What is the value of your Amway business? Ever see anyone sell their Amway business or actually walk away from Amway to collect residual income? Do you ever wonder why crowns and double diamonds are still working, even beyond retirement age for people with jobs?
Thursday, August 11, 2016
Buy From Yourself?
One of the apparently common practices among major IBO groups is still the concept of "buy from yourself". I believe IBO leaders teach this because most people are not familiar or not comfortable selling goods and services. Therefore, to teach buy from yourself makes the business an easier sell. In reality, an Amway IBO is simply a commissioned salesperson with no benefits. But presenting the opportunity that way is unlikely to yield results either, thus the buy from yourself has become a common practice. It sounds like something that most people can do, rather than emphasizing the need to sell to people you don't know.
Buying from youself makes you a customer and not a business owner. Buying from yourself doesn't generate your business a profit. Would you open a car dealership to buy a car? Now I am not suggesting that supporting your own business is a bad idea. What I am suggesting is if you are the primary or exclusive customer of your Amway business, then you aren't really running a business. You are simply a glorified customer. I believe some or many IBOs fall into this category because they are simply unable to move products to non IBOs.
What an IBO is really doing is paying his upline's bonuses. Amway overcharges more than 30% of the cost of their product. They have to do this in order to be able to pay IBO bonuses. Since most IBOs are at 100 PV or less, the lion's share of the bonuses earned are channeled upline when a purchase is made. It is not a level playing field as some IBO leaders might suggest. Also, some of your uplines who don't even know you might benefit from your efforts. Now that's residual income right?
What compounds the situation and makes it worse is when an IBO pays for standing order or attends functions where some of these IBO leaders may teach this bad business practice. You as an IBO already pverpay for products for which upline gets most of the bonus, but then the problem is made worse by IBOs paying to receive this bad advice. When I was an IBO, I heard speakers talk about skipping rent or mortgage payments to attend more functions, or having your family skip a meal so you can buy standing orders. Buying from yourself is just another example of bad advice given from upline to downline. What makes it worse is that some uplines profit by giving bad advice.
Are you buying from yourself almost exclusively? Can you think of any truly successful business where the owner is the main or possibly the only customer? I can't think of any.
Buying from youself makes you a customer and not a business owner. Buying from yourself doesn't generate your business a profit. Would you open a car dealership to buy a car? Now I am not suggesting that supporting your own business is a bad idea. What I am suggesting is if you are the primary or exclusive customer of your Amway business, then you aren't really running a business. You are simply a glorified customer. I believe some or many IBOs fall into this category because they are simply unable to move products to non IBOs.
What an IBO is really doing is paying his upline's bonuses. Amway overcharges more than 30% of the cost of their product. They have to do this in order to be able to pay IBO bonuses. Since most IBOs are at 100 PV or less, the lion's share of the bonuses earned are channeled upline when a purchase is made. It is not a level playing field as some IBO leaders might suggest. Also, some of your uplines who don't even know you might benefit from your efforts. Now that's residual income right?
What compounds the situation and makes it worse is when an IBO pays for standing order or attends functions where some of these IBO leaders may teach this bad business practice. You as an IBO already pverpay for products for which upline gets most of the bonus, but then the problem is made worse by IBOs paying to receive this bad advice. When I was an IBO, I heard speakers talk about skipping rent or mortgage payments to attend more functions, or having your family skip a meal so you can buy standing orders. Buying from yourself is just another example of bad advice given from upline to downline. What makes it worse is that some uplines profit by giving bad advice.
Are you buying from yourself almost exclusively? Can you think of any truly successful business where the owner is the main or possibly the only customer? I can't think of any.
Wednesday, August 10, 2016
The Real Amway Scam?
Amway has been around for a long time. When the company first began, it wasn't uncommon for people to go door to door, perhaps with products in a radio flyer to sell them as a way to make some extra money. There were no extensive training program that I know of and certainly, there wasn't the stigma that the company has now. But in today's world, when people refer to Amway as being a scam, what they usually refering to the motivational leaders and the associated systems. I believe that the systems were first invented as a genuine way to train distance groups, but the income and power of systems seduced some upline leaders into becoming conmen. Thus I believe that many if not most systems are corrupted. I witnessed personally and still hear of stories where IBOs are encouraged to go into debt or sacrifice basic family needs in order to purchase more system materials. Amway's involvement in this is knowing that these abuses occured and not taking any substantial action.
But what are the merits of the program when broken down? Many Amway defenders are quick to point out that many IBOs "do nothing", which may be true, but for the sake of argument, let's not even consider the ones who do nothing. Take the 6-4-2 plan that many use in recruiting. It involves 1 IBO with 78 downline, all of whom do 100 PV. This plan also generally assumes that IBOs will be a part of the system apparently, because non system IBOs generally do not have the dedication to keep moving and selling products. This is because many systems teach IBOs that they are successful when they lose money! In 6-4-2. you have one platinum, allegedly the break even point for system IBOs, and 78 non platinums, spending money on products,and winding up with a net loss, if they are dedicated to the system.
Of course, system expenses vary, depending on which system you are a part of. I have heard IBOs mention that their system expenses may be as low as $75 a month, to over $1000 month for hard core fully dedicated IBOs. I have issued a challenge, which noone has ever undertaken, to shows an actual platinum group where the collective group made a net profit after system expenses were accounted for. Noone has ever come forward to disprove this point. I believe a retailing group could show a net profit, but I do not believe that a group of prosumers or buy from yourselfers could ever collectively net a profit.
So for Amway IBOs and prospects, please keep in mind that it is the system that is often the downfall of many IBOs. A dedication to any system is very likely to nearly guarantee that you will end up with a net loss as an IBO. Can someone still succeed? Sure, but your chances are similar to that of someone hitting a big jackpot in the lottery. At least buying lottery ticket doesn't take up much of your time.
But what are the merits of the program when broken down? Many Amway defenders are quick to point out that many IBOs "do nothing", which may be true, but for the sake of argument, let's not even consider the ones who do nothing. Take the 6-4-2 plan that many use in recruiting. It involves 1 IBO with 78 downline, all of whom do 100 PV. This plan also generally assumes that IBOs will be a part of the system apparently, because non system IBOs generally do not have the dedication to keep moving and selling products. This is because many systems teach IBOs that they are successful when they lose money! In 6-4-2. you have one platinum, allegedly the break even point for system IBOs, and 78 non platinums, spending money on products,and winding up with a net loss, if they are dedicated to the system.
Of course, system expenses vary, depending on which system you are a part of. I have heard IBOs mention that their system expenses may be as low as $75 a month, to over $1000 month for hard core fully dedicated IBOs. I have issued a challenge, which noone has ever undertaken, to shows an actual platinum group where the collective group made a net profit after system expenses were accounted for. Noone has ever come forward to disprove this point. I believe a retailing group could show a net profit, but I do not believe that a group of prosumers or buy from yourselfers could ever collectively net a profit.
So for Amway IBOs and prospects, please keep in mind that it is the system that is often the downfall of many IBOs. A dedication to any system is very likely to nearly guarantee that you will end up with a net loss as an IBO. Can someone still succeed? Sure, but your chances are similar to that of someone hitting a big jackpot in the lottery. At least buying lottery ticket doesn't take up much of your time.
Tuesday, August 9, 2016
Amway Myth, You Didn't Try Hard Enough?
One of the things IBOs are taught is to blame themselves for not working the business hard enough or not doing things right, exactly as upline advised. Actually, nothing could be further from the truth. It's just that uplines want to be absolved from any responsibility so they teach downline that failure in Amway is their own (The downline's) fault. Upline is also quick to take credit for any success, of course. Why shouldn't these same leaders be held accountable for their downline's results? I might add that with such a low success rate in Amway, the teaching is rendered ineffective.
The reason why hard work doesn't equal success is because an Amway IBO is basically a commissioned sales person. In commissioned sales, one can work hard for no reward and at times, little effort may reap large rewards. But in Amway, with a spotty reputation, Amway IBOs are dealt a handicap that most simply cannot overcome. Getting new people to recruitment meetings is hard enough, not even factoring in the abililty to sponsor others. Then you toss in the ridiculous prices for some of these Amway products. When factoring in these tidbits, it's easy to see why uplines teach buy from yourself and selling is not needed. Because selling is next to impossible unless you're selling to sympathetic family and friends.
The work involved is very simple. Sell products and get other IBOs in your downline to be able to leverage your volume. Many IBOs work hard and attend all of the functions and do all of the steps as outlined by upline, but very few reap rewards and most quit when they realize that the system doesn't work. It is sad that on top of losing money, that IBOs are also taught to blame themselves for their demise. Where is the upline when IBOs bust their butts working hard and get no rewards? On top of that, to make it worse, uplines profit from selling training and motivation to their downlines. Why aren't they held acountable?
I've read comments by some Amway defenders wanting to sue Amway critics for a potential loss of business. But most critics, like myself are simply stating our experiences and opinions. Most of which are true and still happening today. So I will ask, what about the millions of former IBOs who may have lost billions of dollars because of false claims which led them to believe that they would get rich following upline advice? Maybe former IBOs should unite and file claims against unethical upline leaders who led them astray? Why not hold these leaders accountable?
In any case, hard work doesn't equate success in Amway and I dare anyone to try to prove me wrong.
The reason why hard work doesn't equal success is because an Amway IBO is basically a commissioned sales person. In commissioned sales, one can work hard for no reward and at times, little effort may reap large rewards. But in Amway, with a spotty reputation, Amway IBOs are dealt a handicap that most simply cannot overcome. Getting new people to recruitment meetings is hard enough, not even factoring in the abililty to sponsor others. Then you toss in the ridiculous prices for some of these Amway products. When factoring in these tidbits, it's easy to see why uplines teach buy from yourself and selling is not needed. Because selling is next to impossible unless you're selling to sympathetic family and friends.
The work involved is very simple. Sell products and get other IBOs in your downline to be able to leverage your volume. Many IBOs work hard and attend all of the functions and do all of the steps as outlined by upline, but very few reap rewards and most quit when they realize that the system doesn't work. It is sad that on top of losing money, that IBOs are also taught to blame themselves for their demise. Where is the upline when IBOs bust their butts working hard and get no rewards? On top of that, to make it worse, uplines profit from selling training and motivation to their downlines. Why aren't they held acountable?
I've read comments by some Amway defenders wanting to sue Amway critics for a potential loss of business. But most critics, like myself are simply stating our experiences and opinions. Most of which are true and still happening today. So I will ask, what about the millions of former IBOs who may have lost billions of dollars because of false claims which led them to believe that they would get rich following upline advice? Maybe former IBOs should unite and file claims against unethical upline leaders who led them astray? Why not hold these leaders accountable?
In any case, hard work doesn't equate success in Amway and I dare anyone to try to prove me wrong.
Monday, August 8, 2016
The Amway Business Mentality?
One of the things IBOs "think" they posssess, but in reality they are far from it, is "Business Mentality". It is not necessarily the fault of the IBOs. Many are sponsored into Amway by trusted friends and lacking business experience, they will "submit" to upline as they are advised and will try to learn about the Amway business. The problem is that many upline leaders teach self serving business practices such as hard core dedication to their tools system, from which they often handsomely profit. Let's examine some of the questionable practices.
"Buy from yourself". If you have a business owner mentality, you only buy from yourself if it's beneficial to your business. Many IBOs talk about ridiculous things like a McDonald's owner would never eat at Burger King. That's bull crap. Just because I own a McDonald's doesn't mean I am eating Big Macs the rest of my life. You cannot spend yourself to prosperity. If I sold pens for $1.00 and my cost was .50, and my competitor had a special on the same pens at 3 for $1.00, I'm buying them from my competition. Also, buying from yourself makes you a customer, not a business owner.
"Ignore facts if you have a dream". This is probably the biggest heap of bull crap taught by some upline. I have seen this spouted in particular by IBOs downline from WWDB and BWW leaders. A business owner studies the facts, not ignores them. Any REAL business owner wants to know how much he is bringing in and how much is going out. That's how you detect the heartbeat of your business. A site visitor named Gina on this site, recently posted a profit/loss statement from her real business. Naturally, IBOs were at a loss to discuss it because it was foreign material to them.
"Submit to upline" Another load of hogwash. Why should someone submit to upline simply because they "sponsored me" or whatever? A real business owner would think independently and make business decisions based on facts and numbers, not on the advice of someone upline who hasn't taken the time to assess each IBO on a personal level to be able to give advice on an IBO's "Indepdendent Business", or worse, advice on their personal lives". Someone who joined Amway before you isn't any kind of a real qualification, yet it's treated as such by the brainwashed IBOs.
"Dedication to the system". Silly advice as well. What dedication does the system have for an IBO? If an IBO succeeds (which is very rare), the system takes credit, but for the more than 99% of people who never make a significant income, it is their own fault if they don't make it. Amway apologists will defend this by saying that many may not have signed up wanting a significant income. While that may be partially true, tell me where people show "plans" designed for the guy who wants an extra $100 a month? The plans shown are always (AFAIK) to go platinum or diamond.
IBOs and information seekers, does any of this sound familiar? Is this a part of your experience? If so, I encourage you to ask questions here and get more information before proceeding with any more "business" activity.
"Buy from yourself". If you have a business owner mentality, you only buy from yourself if it's beneficial to your business. Many IBOs talk about ridiculous things like a McDonald's owner would never eat at Burger King. That's bull crap. Just because I own a McDonald's doesn't mean I am eating Big Macs the rest of my life. You cannot spend yourself to prosperity. If I sold pens for $1.00 and my cost was .50, and my competitor had a special on the same pens at 3 for $1.00, I'm buying them from my competition. Also, buying from yourself makes you a customer, not a business owner.
"Ignore facts if you have a dream". This is probably the biggest heap of bull crap taught by some upline. I have seen this spouted in particular by IBOs downline from WWDB and BWW leaders. A business owner studies the facts, not ignores them. Any REAL business owner wants to know how much he is bringing in and how much is going out. That's how you detect the heartbeat of your business. A site visitor named Gina on this site, recently posted a profit/loss statement from her real business. Naturally, IBOs were at a loss to discuss it because it was foreign material to them.
"Submit to upline" Another load of hogwash. Why should someone submit to upline simply because they "sponsored me" or whatever? A real business owner would think independently and make business decisions based on facts and numbers, not on the advice of someone upline who hasn't taken the time to assess each IBO on a personal level to be able to give advice on an IBO's "Indepdendent Business", or worse, advice on their personal lives". Someone who joined Amway before you isn't any kind of a real qualification, yet it's treated as such by the brainwashed IBOs.
"Dedication to the system". Silly advice as well. What dedication does the system have for an IBO? If an IBO succeeds (which is very rare), the system takes credit, but for the more than 99% of people who never make a significant income, it is their own fault if they don't make it. Amway apologists will defend this by saying that many may not have signed up wanting a significant income. While that may be partially true, tell me where people show "plans" designed for the guy who wants an extra $100 a month? The plans shown are always (AFAIK) to go platinum or diamond.
IBOs and information seekers, does any of this sound familiar? Is this a part of your experience? If so, I encourage you to ask questions here and get more information before proceeding with any more "business" activity.
Friday, August 5, 2016
Why Can't Amway IBOs Give A Straight Answer?
One of the humorous things about Amway IBOs is their ability to say a whole lot without having any substance. They'll talk about how great the business is and how much they have learned and then when you ask if they made any money, you either get dead silence or you get some answer about how they's seen a copy of a check from someone's upline diamond or something like that. But it's very rare that an IBO will be upfront about their earnings. Of course I can understand that someone brand new might not have made a whole lot, but I have seen some IBOs outright lie and say they've been in Amway a month and they're making $5000 a month or some other tall tale like like.
Even when discussing some Amway released information such as the average earnings of an IBO, you can hear all kinds of excuses provided by Amwayers. They will make excuses like most IBOs do nothing. As if that isn't a problem in itself. Or they make stupid analogies about people signing up for a gym membership and then not doing anything. As if owning a business and exercising are the same thing. I even hear questionable claims about how so many people sign up as IBOs to get lower prices. I chuckle when I hear that because Amway's prices in general, are not competitive with big retailers. I believe that is because Amway must add the cost of IBO bonuses in the cost of their goods and services. While an IBO might save from the full retail price of Amway products, you can (in most cases) find the same or a similar product cheaper online or at Walmart.
Another area where IBOs like to divert the discussion is when the discussion is about the success rate of IBOs in general. Based on Amway's own numbers, less than one half of one percent of IBOs reach the level of platinum. Platinum is the level where allegedly, an IBO either breaks even or starts to make some net profit. It would depend on whether the IBO is involved in the tools and to whet level of participation. But IBOs like to downplay this fact as if people simply did not work hard enough or did not learn enough, rather than simply acknowledging that the system itself might be flawed.
The last area I see issues is when talking about selling products. I suspect that product sales to no IBOs is relatively small. I believe there may be some exceptional people who can sell, but people in general, do not like to or do not possess the skills to sell products. Yet I see IBOs making all kinds of stories about "selling" to customers. I rarely get a straight answer about product sales as well. The fact that many Amway IBOs can't give a straight answer is quite telling.
Even when discussing some Amway released information such as the average earnings of an IBO, you can hear all kinds of excuses provided by Amwayers. They will make excuses like most IBOs do nothing. As if that isn't a problem in itself. Or they make stupid analogies about people signing up for a gym membership and then not doing anything. As if owning a business and exercising are the same thing. I even hear questionable claims about how so many people sign up as IBOs to get lower prices. I chuckle when I hear that because Amway's prices in general, are not competitive with big retailers. I believe that is because Amway must add the cost of IBO bonuses in the cost of their goods and services. While an IBO might save from the full retail price of Amway products, you can (in most cases) find the same or a similar product cheaper online or at Walmart.
Another area where IBOs like to divert the discussion is when the discussion is about the success rate of IBOs in general. Based on Amway's own numbers, less than one half of one percent of IBOs reach the level of platinum. Platinum is the level where allegedly, an IBO either breaks even or starts to make some net profit. It would depend on whether the IBO is involved in the tools and to whet level of participation. But IBOs like to downplay this fact as if people simply did not work hard enough or did not learn enough, rather than simply acknowledging that the system itself might be flawed.
The last area I see issues is when talking about selling products. I suspect that product sales to no IBOs is relatively small. I believe there may be some exceptional people who can sell, but people in general, do not like to or do not possess the skills to sell products. Yet I see IBOs making all kinds of stories about "selling" to customers. I rarely get a straight answer about product sales as well. The fact that many Amway IBOs can't give a straight answer is quite telling.
Thursday, August 4, 2016
CORE - The Key To Amway Failure?
Breakdown of CORE and why it doesn’t work. Here are the CORE steps. Some groups may have variations of CORE, but this is generally what many groups use. Some things may have changed but the general premise is likely the same:
1 - Show the Plan (10-15 per month)
2 - Retail the Products (10 customers @10 PV each)
3 – Tapes/cds
4 - Books
5 - Functions (attend all)
6 - Accountability
7 - Counsel with Upline (Be teachable!)
8 - Buy 100% of your own products
9 – Communikate
Many upline will tell you that your success is nearly 100% guaranteed if you follow these steps for 2-5 years. Some Amway enthusiasts will tell you that 6 months of this activity will nearly assure you of a platinum level business. Certain steps are within the IBO’s control, such as reading every day and listening to cds, and attending functions. It is also easy enough to be accountable, counsel with upline, buy your own products, and use KATE (voicemail).
Here’s where an IBO’s efforts will break down. Showing the plan and retailing products. And remember, if you cannot do these steps then you are not considered “CORE” and your upline will likely tell you that it is your own fault and that you simply haven’t been CORE, therefore you did not achieve success. There is some truth in this but let me expose the system in a different angle.
Amway has a spotty reputation in the US. I don’t think anyone can dispute this fact. Therefore, for the vast majority of people, being able to show the plan 10-15 times per month is a nearly impossible task. If you are able to do this, you are a really good salesman or a good liar. In this scenario, the IBO is already successful, but not because of CORE, but simply because the IBO has the gift of being able to convince people into seeing the plan. But for many IBOs, they may contact hundreds of people and not be able to get anyone to see the plan. Even IBOs who follow upline advice on how to contact will probably not be able to show 10-15 plans per month. Thus this IBO, who is doing the work, will not be able to succeed. The system will blame the IBO, but the reality is that the IBO has too big of a disadvantage to overcome.
Secondly, with high prices (on average) and with a spotty reputation, most IBOs are unable to retail products. Amway itself has admitted that less than 4% of Amway products are sold to customers (non IBOs). Thus most IBOs are unable to sell products, therefore they are not CORE, therefore upline will blame the IBO for failure..
What if an IBO contacts 1000 people and cannot get 10 people to see the plan? Upline will claim that IBO is not CORE and therefore it is personal failure of the IBO. IMO, the only reason why upline can claim that CORE works is because in order to do the CORE steps consistently, you have to already be at a certain level of success. The vast majority of IBOs cannot and will never be able to reach that level.
That is the myth and the deception that many uplines will use to attract recruits. That each IBO can do the CORE steps. When only a fraction of 1% ever reach the level of platinum or higher, the numbers strongly support what is written here. Apologists are welcome to try and prove me wrong, but they can't. :D
The main reason why CORE leads to failure is because most of the steps cost you time and money but produces no income. What business owner would spend all that time on non income producing activities?
1 - Show the Plan (10-15 per month)
2 - Retail the Products (10 customers @10 PV each)
3 – Tapes/cds
4 - Books
5 - Functions (attend all)
6 - Accountability
7 - Counsel with Upline (Be teachable!)
8 - Buy 100% of your own products
9 – Communikate
Many upline will tell you that your success is nearly 100% guaranteed if you follow these steps for 2-5 years. Some Amway enthusiasts will tell you that 6 months of this activity will nearly assure you of a platinum level business. Certain steps are within the IBO’s control, such as reading every day and listening to cds, and attending functions. It is also easy enough to be accountable, counsel with upline, buy your own products, and use KATE (voicemail).
Here’s where an IBO’s efforts will break down. Showing the plan and retailing products. And remember, if you cannot do these steps then you are not considered “CORE” and your upline will likely tell you that it is your own fault and that you simply haven’t been CORE, therefore you did not achieve success. There is some truth in this but let me expose the system in a different angle.
Amway has a spotty reputation in the US. I don’t think anyone can dispute this fact. Therefore, for the vast majority of people, being able to show the plan 10-15 times per month is a nearly impossible task. If you are able to do this, you are a really good salesman or a good liar. In this scenario, the IBO is already successful, but not because of CORE, but simply because the IBO has the gift of being able to convince people into seeing the plan. But for many IBOs, they may contact hundreds of people and not be able to get anyone to see the plan. Even IBOs who follow upline advice on how to contact will probably not be able to show 10-15 plans per month. Thus this IBO, who is doing the work, will not be able to succeed. The system will blame the IBO, but the reality is that the IBO has too big of a disadvantage to overcome.
Secondly, with high prices (on average) and with a spotty reputation, most IBOs are unable to retail products. Amway itself has admitted that less than 4% of Amway products are sold to customers (non IBOs). Thus most IBOs are unable to sell products, therefore they are not CORE, therefore upline will blame the IBO for failure..
What if an IBO contacts 1000 people and cannot get 10 people to see the plan? Upline will claim that IBO is not CORE and therefore it is personal failure of the IBO. IMO, the only reason why upline can claim that CORE works is because in order to do the CORE steps consistently, you have to already be at a certain level of success. The vast majority of IBOs cannot and will never be able to reach that level.
That is the myth and the deception that many uplines will use to attract recruits. That each IBO can do the CORE steps. When only a fraction of 1% ever reach the level of platinum or higher, the numbers strongly support what is written here. Apologists are welcome to try and prove me wrong, but they can't. :D
The main reason why CORE leads to failure is because most of the steps cost you time and money but produces no income. What business owner would spend all that time on non income producing activities?
Wednesday, August 3, 2016
Chasing The Impossible Amway Dream?
One of the things that get people excited about joining Amway is the big talk about dreams. My former LOS, WWDB, still has a big annual function called "dream nite". At dream nite, the diamonds will display a slide show with pictures of mansions, sports cars, jets, jet skis, vacations, golf outings and other pictures that depict a lavish lifestyle that will get people excited. For many, the prospect of not having to work 9-5 while still having cash roll in is enough to convince them that Amway is the greatest thing since sliced bread was invented. The sad thing is that the vast majority of Amway IBOs will never achieve it and frankly. aside from the pictures, who knows whether the diamonds actually enjoy the lifestyles they show. The math doesn't support what they are pitching.
The problem is that the diamonds are simply filling prospects and IBOs with false hopes and dreams. Hopes and dreams that will not materialize except perhaps for a very select few. What you can typically find is that attaching hopes and dreams to a business vehicle as a means to achieve the dreams is a powerful selling point.
While some people may attain some of these goals and trappings of wealth, the vast majority, probably more than 99% of people who come and go through the business, end up making nothing and most with a loss of money. Even those who may put forth heroic efforts often find themselves at a loss after several months or several years of effort. I suspect that many diamonds themselves, cannot afford the luxuries they show off. There is evidence of this happening. Several diamonds have had homes foreclosed, a prominent triple diamond was in bankruptcy proceedings. Former diamonds have come forth and explained that their income came mainly from tools and that Amway income wasn't as much. Some diamonds have resigned or quit, which debunks the myth of lifelong residual income. Some diamonds even took their entire groups and left Amway for other MLMs. So much for Amway being the best and providing lifelong residual income.
It is a sad thing indeed, that so many innocent prospects and IBOs have been deceived by shady upline leaders into thinking that in a short time frame, they will be purchasing homes in cash and retiring before the age of 40, and "walking the beaches" for the rest of their lives. In fact, I don't know of any diamonds who have done just that. It appears that crown ambassadors and others are all still working or actually passing away while on the job. Why aren't there people going diamond and then "walking away" to live a quiet life of luxury unmatched by any other opportunity?
Maybe it is a big lie or a myth? IBOs are basically dedicating their time and money to chasing an unattainable dream? How many IBOs do you know of that achieved those dreams?
The problem is that the diamonds are simply filling prospects and IBOs with false hopes and dreams. Hopes and dreams that will not materialize except perhaps for a very select few. What you can typically find is that attaching hopes and dreams to a business vehicle as a means to achieve the dreams is a powerful selling point.
While some people may attain some of these goals and trappings of wealth, the vast majority, probably more than 99% of people who come and go through the business, end up making nothing and most with a loss of money. Even those who may put forth heroic efforts often find themselves at a loss after several months or several years of effort. I suspect that many diamonds themselves, cannot afford the luxuries they show off. There is evidence of this happening. Several diamonds have had homes foreclosed, a prominent triple diamond was in bankruptcy proceedings. Former diamonds have come forth and explained that their income came mainly from tools and that Amway income wasn't as much. Some diamonds have resigned or quit, which debunks the myth of lifelong residual income. Some diamonds even took their entire groups and left Amway for other MLMs. So much for Amway being the best and providing lifelong residual income.
It is a sad thing indeed, that so many innocent prospects and IBOs have been deceived by shady upline leaders into thinking that in a short time frame, they will be purchasing homes in cash and retiring before the age of 40, and "walking the beaches" for the rest of their lives. In fact, I don't know of any diamonds who have done just that. It appears that crown ambassadors and others are all still working or actually passing away while on the job. Why aren't there people going diamond and then "walking away" to live a quiet life of luxury unmatched by any other opportunity?
Maybe it is a big lie or a myth? IBOs are basically dedicating their time and money to chasing an unattainable dream? How many IBOs do you know of that achieved those dreams?
Tuesday, August 2, 2016
The Amway Iceberg?
I was in discussion on another forum and a comment was made about Amway being an iceberg, because you see the shiny clean ice on the top but you do not see the majority of the iceberg. Or in other words, the diamonds show you the fancy suits, jewelry, care, mansions, jets and what you don't see is the financial carnage that takes place in their downlines at times. My former upline would tell audiences that they could skip meals to buy more standing orders because you might hear the one thing that could make your business explode. Sadly, I don't think I've ever seen or heard of someone's business "exploding".
Sure, on standing orders, you won't hear too much of the unethical and "wrong" teaching, because some of this is monitored by Amway, but it's the night owls and smaller group meetings where the real teaching is disseminated. This is where you are told to practically sell your soul to achieve in Amway. This is where the teaching comes in where you should be purchasing excessive amounts of tools in order to succeed. This is where you are told to never miss a function unless it's for your own funeral. A newbie or casual observer won't see these things but if you ever commit to becoming a business builder, this is likely to become your world. This is how the leaders get their unethical teachings to downline, by sending the information downline via the platinums.
You don't see the backstage at functions and meetings. Former rubies and platinums have made commentary about the diamonds literally laughing about how gullible the downline are. You don't see the where the cash collected at the meetings and functions go. There had been some past comments about literally, suitcases of cash leaving the premises. If your upline has a mansion and a fleet of nice cars, it's likely that your tools money played a significant part in your diamond obtaining it.
It's a simple conclusion. The tools have a higher markup than Amway products and have fewer beneficiaries to split up the bonus. A $7.00 Amway product might cost $3.00 or so to make and the rest will be bonus money split up by the layers of IBOs. Whereas a $7.00 cd might take 50 cents to produce and only platinums and higher receive any compensation from this source of income. But rank and file IBOs rarely ever see a true and transparent picture of this business. It is shrouded in secrecy, just like the underside of an iceberg. I challenge IBOs to be real businessmen and women and ask upline the tough questions about where the money is made. Do not accpet rhetoric and anecdotal stories. In real business, schedule C business tax returns are the normal way for verification of business income. If you are going to "invest" your hard earned money into the system to the benfit of upline, you should demand this information.
Would any of you purchase a conventional business from someone without proof that it is profitable? Why would an Amway business be any different? Seek a true picture of what you are getting into.
Sure, on standing orders, you won't hear too much of the unethical and "wrong" teaching, because some of this is monitored by Amway, but it's the night owls and smaller group meetings where the real teaching is disseminated. This is where you are told to practically sell your soul to achieve in Amway. This is where the teaching comes in where you should be purchasing excessive amounts of tools in order to succeed. This is where you are told to never miss a function unless it's for your own funeral. A newbie or casual observer won't see these things but if you ever commit to becoming a business builder, this is likely to become your world. This is how the leaders get their unethical teachings to downline, by sending the information downline via the platinums.
You don't see the backstage at functions and meetings. Former rubies and platinums have made commentary about the diamonds literally laughing about how gullible the downline are. You don't see the where the cash collected at the meetings and functions go. There had been some past comments about literally, suitcases of cash leaving the premises. If your upline has a mansion and a fleet of nice cars, it's likely that your tools money played a significant part in your diamond obtaining it.
It's a simple conclusion. The tools have a higher markup than Amway products and have fewer beneficiaries to split up the bonus. A $7.00 Amway product might cost $3.00 or so to make and the rest will be bonus money split up by the layers of IBOs. Whereas a $7.00 cd might take 50 cents to produce and only platinums and higher receive any compensation from this source of income. But rank and file IBOs rarely ever see a true and transparent picture of this business. It is shrouded in secrecy, just like the underside of an iceberg. I challenge IBOs to be real businessmen and women and ask upline the tough questions about where the money is made. Do not accpet rhetoric and anecdotal stories. In real business, schedule C business tax returns are the normal way for verification of business income. If you are going to "invest" your hard earned money into the system to the benfit of upline, you should demand this information.
Would any of you purchase a conventional business from someone without proof that it is profitable? Why would an Amway business be any different? Seek a true picture of what you are getting into.
Monday, August 1, 2016
The Amway Psychology?
I’m not sure whether this plan was carefully crafted out or whether it just evolved, but the way some uplines show the plan is cleverly designed to suck people into their systems. If you aren’t aware or careful, it’s easy to get caught up in the excitement of the presentation. The presentation is full of deception and I will try to point out these items in my analysis.
The speaker may talk about how he once thought he was “doing okay” in life. That he was making a living and able to meet his financial obligations. But he thought there might be more. One day he saw the plan and it changed his life. He did not realize he had gotten into a rut of going to work and going home every day and looking forward to his 2 weeks off each year. (This is relatable for many) That time and money are so important in life. Control of time and money is the key to success. Many people have lots of money but work all day and nite. Or people have time but are broke and can’t do much. The speaker might mention dreams or goals such as having an extra $500 a month or more. What would you do for an extra $500 a month. What about an extra $50,000 a year? Wouldn’t it be nice to have the wife stay home with the kids instead of leaving the family to go to work? Like the “Leave it to Beaver” days? (This gets the women excited)
The speaker will likely mention something about the economy and how prices always go up. The speaker may mention the 4 “I’s” that suck money out of your paycheck. The four I’s are Interest, Income Tax, Insurance and Inflation. The speaker may talk about how the government will take their cut and so on until you get your “net”. The speaker may mention how so many Americans are dead or broke by age 65, and that social security will collapse. (This instills fear in many people).
The speaker might also go on to mention how so many marriages are falling apart in the US because of financial stress. That couples work so hard that they have no family time and it hurts marriages. That people work so many hours these days that they are married to their desks. The “manager” of the office is the first one there and the last one to go home. That despite all of this work and effort, people are falling into debt. Credit cards maxed out, loans, trying to keep up with the Joneses. (Many people can relate to this)
But now, because he was looking for opportunity/open minded one day, he saw an opportunity. This opportunity changed his life and can do the same for you! The speaker now wakes up at the crack of noon. His wife stays home with him and the kids. They take nice vacations and they do what they want when they want. (Of course, who doesn’t? But is this true?) The opportunity takes advantage of the internet and allows you to leverage your time and money so that you can create a residual walk away income. (But nobody walks away do they?)
This is approximately the point in the presentation where they mention “Amway” At this point, the speaker will defend Amway, stating that if you can make money, does it matter.? If you can save money, does it matter? The speaker may go into the product line and mention partner stores and will likely show a 6-4-2 plan or a variation of it. In every case, they will show a best case scenario, not what is likely. Many prospects will leave thinking “all I need is six”. They don’t understand how unlikely it is to sponsor six platinums and there is no mention of the retention rates, the income most IBOs can expect, and firm questions will be deflected to the prospect’s inviter. The speaker may also discourage you from speaking to friends and family as they may have a bad experience but the diamond is successful and knows more about Amway than your family and friends.
Joe’s commentary: So the speaker becomes very relatable from the start. His situation in life will be like many in the audience. He will talk about doing okay,. But wanting more or looking for more. He talks about debts and many in the audience will also relate. They get people to think about dream cars or vacations. He talks about walk away income, but doesn’t mention that very very few ever make significant money and apparently, not many actually walk away either. They say you will make money and save money by doing the business. It’s hard to argue against that,.except most people will not make money or save money. In fact most people, if they participate fully or partially in the training system, they will lose money. For the dedicated IBOs, many of them LOSE LOTS OF MONEY. The plan is crafted out to sound sensible and relatable, but many IBOs will give it a try and shortly after, will realize that the system doesn’t work, that the reputation of Amway IBOs is soiled and sponsoring people or even getting people to see the plan is a barrier that most people simply cannot overcome. At least if you know what’s going on, you may be able to avoid the trap.
The speaker may talk about how he once thought he was “doing okay” in life. That he was making a living and able to meet his financial obligations. But he thought there might be more. One day he saw the plan and it changed his life. He did not realize he had gotten into a rut of going to work and going home every day and looking forward to his 2 weeks off each year. (This is relatable for many) That time and money are so important in life. Control of time and money is the key to success. Many people have lots of money but work all day and nite. Or people have time but are broke and can’t do much. The speaker might mention dreams or goals such as having an extra $500 a month or more. What would you do for an extra $500 a month. What about an extra $50,000 a year? Wouldn’t it be nice to have the wife stay home with the kids instead of leaving the family to go to work? Like the “Leave it to Beaver” days? (This gets the women excited)
The speaker will likely mention something about the economy and how prices always go up. The speaker may mention the 4 “I’s” that suck money out of your paycheck. The four I’s are Interest, Income Tax, Insurance and Inflation. The speaker may talk about how the government will take their cut and so on until you get your “net”. The speaker may mention how so many Americans are dead or broke by age 65, and that social security will collapse. (This instills fear in many people).
The speaker might also go on to mention how so many marriages are falling apart in the US because of financial stress. That couples work so hard that they have no family time and it hurts marriages. That people work so many hours these days that they are married to their desks. The “manager” of the office is the first one there and the last one to go home. That despite all of this work and effort, people are falling into debt. Credit cards maxed out, loans, trying to keep up with the Joneses. (Many people can relate to this)
But now, because he was looking for opportunity/open minded one day, he saw an opportunity. This opportunity changed his life and can do the same for you! The speaker now wakes up at the crack of noon. His wife stays home with him and the kids. They take nice vacations and they do what they want when they want. (Of course, who doesn’t? But is this true?) The opportunity takes advantage of the internet and allows you to leverage your time and money so that you can create a residual walk away income. (But nobody walks away do they?)
This is approximately the point in the presentation where they mention “Amway” At this point, the speaker will defend Amway, stating that if you can make money, does it matter.? If you can save money, does it matter? The speaker may go into the product line and mention partner stores and will likely show a 6-4-2 plan or a variation of it. In every case, they will show a best case scenario, not what is likely. Many prospects will leave thinking “all I need is six”. They don’t understand how unlikely it is to sponsor six platinums and there is no mention of the retention rates, the income most IBOs can expect, and firm questions will be deflected to the prospect’s inviter. The speaker may also discourage you from speaking to friends and family as they may have a bad experience but the diamond is successful and knows more about Amway than your family and friends.
Joe’s commentary: So the speaker becomes very relatable from the start. His situation in life will be like many in the audience. He will talk about doing okay,. But wanting more or looking for more. He talks about debts and many in the audience will also relate. They get people to think about dream cars or vacations. He talks about walk away income, but doesn’t mention that very very few ever make significant money and apparently, not many actually walk away either. They say you will make money and save money by doing the business. It’s hard to argue against that,.except most people will not make money or save money. In fact most people, if they participate fully or partially in the training system, they will lose money. For the dedicated IBOs, many of them LOSE LOTS OF MONEY. The plan is crafted out to sound sensible and relatable, but many IBOs will give it a try and shortly after, will realize that the system doesn’t work, that the reputation of Amway IBOs is soiled and sponsoring people or even getting people to see the plan is a barrier that most people simply cannot overcome. At least if you know what’s going on, you may be able to avoid the trap.
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